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Yeah, while I'm pretty much willing to believe this just due to the people involved, it is curious that no one has been willing to put their name on an actual r

Yeah, while I'm pretty much willing to believe this just due to the people involved, it is curious that no one has been willing to put their name on an actual rape accusation.

adwn 10y ago
Maybe because that's a very personal matter? I imagine that most people that have been victims of rape do not want their name to be part of the public discussion.
- ultramancool 10y ago
  Perhaps, but if you're going to make public accusations against him, but then back out before anyone can validate them, that seems... suspect at best. What, it's better to let him go out and hurt others than to take it public or legal?
  - samastur 10y ago
    No, it really doesn't based on research so far. I also do not understand your obsession with alleged rape. If it turned out that rape part was not true, but others were, would you see Applebaum differently? I sure as hell wouldn't.
    - ultramancool 10y ago
      I certainly would. There's a major difference between someone making some offensive comments (even repeatedly) and someone committing violent crime.
      - tobltobs 10y ago
        So you are fine with his other behaviour?
        ultramancool 10y ago
        Absolutely not, but there's a world of difference still.
        rm_-rf_slash 10y ago
        I get what you're saying... but back when I worked at a grocery store and called out a lazy stoner I worked with for being exceptionally slow and inefficient, he waited until I was alone in the stock room and held a knife to me and said if I ever did anything like that again, he would cut me. There was no physical harm, but I was shaken enough to quit on the spot when the manager told me he would not be fired. Here's why the difference gap is smaller than you think: I can never be un-scared from that event.
        patrickg_zill 10y ago
        That absolutely would be classed as a physical assault, not a psychological one, however, as I understand the law.
      - samastur 10y ago
        I would not describe his acts as "some offensive comments". The reason why I don't see much of a difference is because I don't find the difference between psychological and physical violence that important when effect is similar and to me it seems to be.
        ultramancool 10y ago
        > I don't find the difference between psychological and physical violence that important when effect is similar There's good reason why these crimes are differentiated in the laws of every country around. The effects are not remotely comparable and to suggest that they are is quite offensive to victims of real violence.
        samastur 10y ago
        I disagree. They are differentiated because we did not understand the immediate and long term effects of both and it is difficult to change cultural norms. As someone who has worked with victims of long term harassment (of both sexes) and have therefore seen up close such effects, I find offensive your implicit statement that psychological violence is somehow not real violence.
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- MrZongle2 10y ago
  "I imagine that most people that have been victims of rape do not want their name to be part of the public discussion." I think this is a reasonable assumption. However, that doesn't change the fact that if nobody officially stands up and makes use of the legal system, a predator will go unpunished....and quite possibly hurt others. Unless one is hoping that vigilantism will take care of the problem, but that's rather horrible too.
kemayo 10y ago
That's pretty standard for criminal rape cases, mind you. There were laws in the US prohibiting revealing the identity of the victim in a rape case, but they got struck down as unconstitutional -- there's still a strong cultural norm in the media of not announcing it. It's also a good idea. Being raped is bad enough; if the bar for consequences for your rapist becomes "I have to loudly announce my rape to the world", that's even worse. This can be viewed as a web-of-trust situation. The raped person told the leaders of the Tor project, who believed them. You can now either wait for possible criminal charges that might be going on behind the scenes, or you can trust the Tor leaders.

Yeah, while I'm pretty much willing to believe this just due to the people involved, it is curious that no one has been willing to put their name on an actual rape accusation.

adwn 10y ago

Maybe because that's a very personal matter? I imagine that most people that have been victims of rape do not want their name to be part of the public discussion.

ultramancool 10y ago
Perhaps, but if you're going to make public accusations against him, but then back out before anyone can validate them, that seems... suspect at best. What, it's better to let him go out and hurt others than to take it public or legal?
- samastur 10y ago
  No, it really doesn't based on research so far. I also do not understand your obsession with alleged rape. If it turned out that rape part was not true, but others were, would you see Applebaum differently? I sure as hell wouldn't.
  - ultramancool 10y ago
    I certainly would. There's a major difference between someone making some offensive comments (even repeatedly) and someone committing violent crime.
    - tobltobs 10y ago
      So you are fine with his other behaviour?
      - ultramancool 10y ago
        Absolutely not, but there's a world of difference still.
        rm_-rf_slash 10y ago
        I get what you're saying... but back when I worked at a grocery store and called out a lazy stoner I worked with for being exceptionally slow and inefficient, he waited until I was alone in the stock room and held a knife to me and said if I ever did anything like that again, he would cut me. There was no physical harm, but I was shaken enough to quit on the spot when the manager told me he would not be fired. Here's why the difference gap is smaller than you think: I can never be un-scared from that event.
        patrickg_zill 10y ago
        That absolutely would be classed as a physical assault, not a psychological one, however, as I understand the law.
    - samastur 10y ago
      I would not describe his acts as "some offensive comments". The reason why I don't see much of a difference is because I don't find the difference between psychological and physical violence that important when effect is similar and to me it seems to be.
      - ultramancool 10y ago
        > I don't find the difference between psychological and physical violence that important when effect is similar There's good reason why these crimes are differentiated in the laws of every country around. The effects are not remotely comparable and to suggest that they are is quite offensive to victims of real violence.
        samastur 10y ago
        I disagree. They are differentiated because we did not understand the immediate and long term effects of both and it is difficult to change cultural norms. As someone who has worked with victims of long term harassment (of both sexes) and have therefore seen up close such effects, I find offensive your implicit statement that psychological violence is somehow not real violence.
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        [deleted]
MrZongle2 10y ago
"I imagine that most people that have been victims of rape do not want their name to be part of the public discussion." I think this is a reasonable assumption. However, that doesn't change the fact that if nobody officially stands up and makes use of the legal system, a predator will go unpunished....and quite possibly hurt others. Unless one is hoping that vigilantism will take care of the problem, but that's rather horrible too.

kemayo 10y ago

That's pretty standard for criminal rape cases, mind you. There were laws in the US prohibiting revealing the identity of the victim in a rape case, but they got struck down as unconstitutional -- there's still a strong cultural norm in the media of not announcing it. It's also a good idea. Being raped is bad enough; if the bar for consequences for your rapist becomes "I have to loudly announce my rape to the world", that's even worse. This can be viewed as a web-of-trust situation. The raped person told the leaders of the Tor project, who believed them. You can now either wait for possible criminal charges that might be going on behind the scenes, or you can trust the Tor leaders.