4 ms·

highly addictive is a pretty serious stretch don't you think. It is definitely possible do develop a psychological dependency, but nothing like morphine, nicoti

by fhood 10y ago

highly addictive is a pretty serious stretch don't you think. It is definitely possible do develop a psychological dependency, but nothing like morphine, nicotine, or even caffeine.

darpa_escapee 10y ago
Like the drugs you've listed, it builds a physical dependence if used frequently enough. Someone who is physically dependent will experience withdrawals in the absence of ketamine. Like those drugs, it induces a desire to consume more of the substance in many users in such a way that something like codeine does and ibuprofen doesn't. Ketamine is a dopamine reuptake inhibitor, possibly leading to some of the euphoric and reinforcing effects of the drug. Cocaine, methylphenidate and methamphetamine are examples of addictive and abused dopamine reuptake inhibitors. Addictive drugs have direct or downstream effects on the dopamine system. It also stimulates the D2 subtype of dopamine receptors.
- spdustin 10y ago
  Edit: reply was meant for GP Ketamine primarily acts on glutamate, one of the reasons it's such an "effective" anesthetic, as the specific glutamate receptor (NMDA) it acts on is involved both in memory formation and the rather complex neurological process that leads to experiencing chronic pain. Its effect on dopamine reuptake (along with norepinephrine and serotonin), GABA potentiation, and opioid receptors means, roughly, it affects much more of the brain's chemistry than the "unwashed masses" using it are aware of. They think it's relatively safe because it wears off faster than PCP (it does) or other depressants (it does) but in reality it dramatically affects multiple systems in their bodies, with some effects building up over time to ultimately cause physical damage (like bladder wall thickening, or damage to cardiac tissues). And in the meantime, they come to relish the escape of the K-hole. At least, until they have a bad trip, because the hallucinations they have are still controlled by their own brains, and if they're having a bad time in life, their hallucinations aren't going to be helpful. What's worse, because they think it's like any other depressant, they freely combine it with Adderall. Ketamine is a cardiovascular stimulant, and mixing with Adderall has a very real risk of proving fatal. Psychological addiction causes users to disregard all these risks, even the ones the users know about, and pursue taking the drug regardless, and is no less dangerous than physical addiction. In fact, because of its effects on dopaminergic modulation and opioid receptors, there is an easy argument to be made for the addictive potential of ketamine. Further, it's important to understand: rats will self-dose with it, humans rate the high they get from low doses of it as being likable and causing them to want more, daily users often go through withdrawal symptoms and experience cravings after they stop using, and users rapidly develop a tolerance for it - all of these are metrics used to determine how addictive something is. Which is to say, in the case of Ketamine, quite. So, no, it's not a stretch at all. That doesn't limit its usefulness in clinical settings, but do not fool yourself or anyone else that it's not addictive.
  - bytefactory 10y ago
    Thank you for the detailed explanation! I've often wanted to try K to help battle my nastier depressive episodes, but your comment definitely gave me pause. It's very tempting to look around at all the party usage of K and forget how dangerous it could potentially be.

by fhood 10y ago

highly addictive is a pretty serious stretch don't you think. It is definitely possible do develop a psychological dependency, but nothing like morphine, nicotine, or even caffeine.

darpa_escapee 10y ago

Like the drugs you've listed, it builds a physical dependence if used frequently enough. Someone who is physically dependent will experience withdrawals in the absence of ketamine. Like those drugs, it induces a desire to consume more of the substance in many users in such a way that something like codeine does and ibuprofen doesn't. Ketamine is a dopamine reuptake inhibitor, possibly leading to some of the euphoric and reinforcing effects of the drug. Cocaine, methylphenidate and methamphetamine are examples of addictive and abused dopamine reuptake inhibitors. Addictive drugs have direct or downstream effects on the dopamine system. It also stimulates the D2 subtype of dopamine receptors.

spdustin 10y ago
Edit: reply was meant for GP Ketamine primarily acts on glutamate, one of the reasons it's such an "effective" anesthetic, as the specific glutamate receptor (NMDA) it acts on is involved both in memory formation and the rather complex neurological process that leads to experiencing chronic pain. Its effect on dopamine reuptake (along with norepinephrine and serotonin), GABA potentiation, and opioid receptors means, roughly, it affects much more of the brain's chemistry than the "unwashed masses" using it are aware of. They think it's relatively safe because it wears off faster than PCP (it does) or other depressants (it does) but in reality it dramatically affects multiple systems in their bodies, with some effects building up over time to ultimately cause physical damage (like bladder wall thickening, or damage to cardiac tissues). And in the meantime, they come to relish the escape of the K-hole. At least, until they have a bad trip, because the hallucinations they have are still controlled by their own brains, and if they're having a bad time in life, their hallucinations aren't going to be helpful. What's worse, because they think it's like any other depressant, they freely combine it with Adderall. Ketamine is a cardiovascular stimulant, and mixing with Adderall has a very real risk of proving fatal. Psychological addiction causes users to disregard all these risks, even the ones the users know about, and pursue taking the drug regardless, and is no less dangerous than physical addiction. In fact, because of its effects on dopaminergic modulation and opioid receptors, there is an easy argument to be made for the addictive potential of ketamine. Further, it's important to understand: rats will self-dose with it, humans rate the high they get from low doses of it as being likable and causing them to want more, daily users often go through withdrawal symptoms and experience cravings after they stop using, and users rapidly develop a tolerance for it - all of these are metrics used to determine how addictive something is. Which is to say, in the case of Ketamine, quite. So, no, it's not a stretch at all. That doesn't limit its usefulness in clinical settings, but do not fool yourself or anyone else that it's not addictive.
- bytefactory 10y ago
  Thank you for the detailed explanation! I've often wanted to try K to help battle my nastier depressive episodes, but your comment definitely gave me pause. It's very tempting to look around at all the party usage of K and forget how dangerous it could potentially be.