6 ms·
Like the forced Win10 updates, spyware, ads directly in the OS which you paid for, ...?
by badlogic 10y ago
Like the forced Win10 updates, spyware, ads directly in the OS which you paid for, ...?
- lloyd-christmas 10y agoYou not liking it doesn't make it a poor business strategy.
- ZanyProgrammer 10y agoBy that standard, Ballmer doubling down on the shitty enterprise software that still makes gobs of money was a good strategy.
- imron 10y agoBut large numbers of people not liking it does make it a poor business strategy - not immediately, but it's the sort of thing people will remember.
- lloyd-christmas 10y agoLarge numbers of people in the tech community. Most people aren't us.
- SpaceManiac 10y agoI would think that non-techies would be even more confused and annoyed by their computer suddenly drastically changing out from underneath them without their permission.
- lloyd-christmas 10y agoAnd then they'd get over it. Oddly enough, my parents upgraded this past week: Mom: Honey, what's this thing stopping me from [shopping]? Dad: Don't click the button! Mom: [long lecture about how she's trying to do stuff for her grandkids]. Dad: Fine, just hit the damn button. Me: DON'T HIT THE BUTTON! I'll walk you through it. I proceeded to explain it to them. 5 days later they don't even remember/care. I guarantee you my grandmother doesn't give a shit either, nor do most of my siblings. So far, I'm at a 6:2 ratio of not caring (one of my brothers is a developer). My parents aren't exactly ignorant in regards to tech, but it simply doesn't effect them to the extent it bothers you/us.
- tamana 10y agoMost of us get repeated phone calls asking where the buttons went. Learning new things gets harder with age.
- taude 10y agoApple's proven that the general population get over this pretty quickly, though. Look at their iOS 7 update.
- Silhouette 10y agoOne of my family, who isn't particularly technical, bought a pre-iOS7 iPad after trying out someone else's and liking it. Soon it was running iOS 7 after prompting to update to the new OS. Soon after that it went back to the shop for a full refund, because the person who had liked it before found the new OS and the things that broke in the process of updating that annoying.
- tajen 10y agoForced Windows 10 upgrade became a meme on 9gag ("Went to the toilets and saw this", etc). I learnt about the story over there before it was on HN. I'm not saying 9gag is representative, but I counter the "no-one noticed the forced upgrades". Even my parents did. Everyone noticed.
- argonaut 10y agoMost people have not heard of 9gag. Most adults probably don't really know what a meme is yet either (they've probably seen a few, just don't really get it yet).
- lloyd-christmas 10y agoThe hacker news/imgur/9gag/reddit demographic is relatively young. Some of us definitely suffer a confirmation bias from the misrepresentation of ages, especially given the significant population of boomers.
- Sylos 10y agoHis point was that even on 9GAG, which does not have a tech-focused community, this is a central talking point, so it's not just the tech-crowd which is pissed off about this. Sure, 9GAGgers are still at least capable of operating a computer or smartphone, but if you move even further down in tech-capabilities, it also becomes quite unlikely that those people will buy something from Microsoft to begin with.
- lloyd-christmas 10y agoHere's the demographics of 9gag: http://9gag.com/gag/3325624/9gag-demographics http://9gag.com/gag/3325624/9gag-demographics They aren't consumers. Beyond that, Microsoft isn't a company that targets individuals. They make their money from companies. They don't need to care about 22 year olds that have $100k of student debt and will pirate most software anyway.
- argonaut 10y ago9GAG does have a tech savvy community, that's my point.
- joosters 10y agoMy dad isn't in the 'tech community' but he'll certainly remember the windows 10 upgrade as it broke his computer.
- davnn 10y agoDid he consider going for a Mac then?
- Silhouette 10y agoBut a lot of people who make purchasing decisions for their business are. And a lot of people who advise non-technical friends and family on technical matters are, too. Also, Windows 10 updates have broken so many things for so many people that it seems quite a few of my less technically inclined friends and family are aware of the potential problems anyway.
- tunap 10y agoAnd the lobbyists have made the spurious practices, ala 'GatorWallet', OK for the "good guys" so it's no longer illegal, either.
- tunap 10y agoA little late, but for the downvoters' edification, see if you can spot the conflict of interest when a fortmer Gator/Claria exec joins the DHS Data Privacy & Integrity Advisory Comittee. Feel free to check the other members' agendas: http://www.bloomberg.com/research/stocks/private/person.asp?personId=10062171&privcapId=104451&previousCapId=104451&previousTitle=Morrison%20&%20Foerster%20LLP http://www.bloomberg.com/research/stocks/private/person.asp?... Or, here's the legwork done for you from 2011: http://www.boilingfrogspost.com/2011/11/30/bfp-report-meet-the-department-of-homeland-security%E2%80%99s-%E2%80%98distinguished%E2%80%99-privacy-advisory-committee-members/ http://www.boilingfrogspost.com/2011/11/30/bfp-report-meet-t...
- prirun 10y agoI went to a store once, and their cash registers were down because a Windows update was forced on them. One was working, 2 weren't. A store manager was on the phone with some tech support guy and was not happy.
- lloyd-christmas 10y agoI went to a store once and that didn't happen. I work in a building of 1000 people. MAYBE 30-50 of them cared, and half those people still won't act on it. People are trying their hardest to find allies. When it comes down to it, consumers are perfectly OK with the status quo. The status quo is Microsoft doing whatever they want. "Everyone" hates Monsanto, yet they still are one of the largest companies in the world. "Everyone" hates Goldman Sachs, yet every retirement portfolio is filled with their products.
- overgryphon 10y agoThey shouldn't have been using the consumer version. I can sympathize, but that business both violated their license and ignored nine months of news and popups about the windows 10 update.
- Silhouette 10y agoIt seems we're talking about cash registers here. If their software happened to be running on Windows but the business bought them as self-contained devices, I'm not sure why the business staff would necessarily even have realised Windows was running on them, never mind been responsible for any software licence agreements or the like. The supplier of those cash registers might have made mistakes here, but the business staff are well justified in being upset at critical devices stopping working because of something like this.
- asadlionpk 10y agoiOS is the same, I see "update to 9.something" everyday! Same goes for iTunes when you plug in your phone.
- arsalanb 10y agoAny time Microsoft is criticized for making the most boring tech out there, and looking like an uninspired company, there's always one person to hit back at Apple (and more often than not, the iPhone/iOS)
- SmellyGeekBoy 10y agoIt's almost as if most software sucks. I often wonder why people feel the need to give into their tribal urges and pick sides.
- yeowMeng 10y agoThe difference is when I update on iOS 9.something things will work. When I update windows, I have to buy a new printer or, the headphone jack no longer works...
- Cthulhu_ 10y agoThe forced updates are something that's been long overdue. Imagine a world without old versions of IE that your webapps still have to support because else you're losing 10% of your users.
- webmaven 10y agoForced browser updates are one thing, but forced upgrading of the OS? Yuck.
- slig 10y agoOr a world where a forced update breaks my parents' computer that was working perfectly fine before.
- abakker 10y agoWithout them, your parents' computer would just be insecure, instead. Unfortunately, keeping things static doesn't work so well with internet connected devices. It would be nice if things didn't break with updates, though.
- abakker 10y agoI will backpedal a bit and say though: it is never OK to arbitrarily reboot a system. Never. I'll also say that I would not use windows 10 for anything important. The idea behind their update system is generally sound, but their execution is not good.
- ajmurmann 10y agoAs opposed to a world full of legacy systems with security holes that are part of botnets.
- Silhouette 10y agoApplying security updates by default would solve that problem just as well. From the user's point of view, there is no good reason to force updates against a user's explicit decision, and there is no good reason to push non-security/stability updates even by default. The only time forcing all updates in that way makes a difference is when Microsoft wants to override a user's deliberate preference not to have their system changed in that way. This cannot possibly be in the user's interest, only Microsoft's.
- bauc 10y agoMight make people wake up and look at alternatives finally (can hope). I'm definitely thinking Win 7 is my last Windows OS.
- nkassis 10y agoThe alternative all have their issue too. I think Win 10 has a lot going for it right now, it's hardly the worse OS of the major one available now days.
- throwaway1979 10y agoI just disabled forced update on my box. It was shocking that MSFT did not make the process straightforward. Ended up downloading a third party tool. Shocking! Recent MSFT behavior was making me think they've changed. I guess not. This genius acquisition indicates the old MSFT is alive and well. Given the dollar amount, the good news is that they can't do too many of these moves without sinking their ship.
- partiallypro 10y agoSpyware? Really? I can understand the updates making people upset (though they should update!,) and the "suggested apps" in the start menu (which luckily you can turn off.) But calling Windows 10 spyware is total nonsense. Do you think that every other major OS, including Android and iOS, OSX don't take telemetry metrics? You're insane. You could never improve the OS, if you didn't. Google takes telemetry data from your search results, which frankly are far more invasive than how you scroll through your start menu or how often you use the action center. It's all anonymized, I don't see the problem. I certainly wouldn't call it "spyware," that just a smear and has nothing to do with reality. They don't track your keystrokes, unless you are using Cortana, which guess what? So does Google/Apple/Amazon when you use their assistants. So you're going to switch to a competitor of Microsofts because they started doing what their competitors already did? Fantastic logic.
- robbbbbbbbb 10y agoJust because something is normal doesn't make it right. And just because something takes some telemetry data doesn't mean taking any data is ok. Microsoft has done just fine with windows without taking all this additional information, so I just don't understand the argument that they need it. Also, I think windows 10 is closer to adware than spyware. I think it is adware as it sneakily installs itself, and it has ads.
- partiallypro 10y ago> Just because something is normal doesn't make it right. That's debatable, but why should Microsoft allow its competitors have an advantage over them because of telemetry data? The collection doesn't do you any harm, it's not invasive. They aren't looking at your file names, or the text in your documents or your keystrokes. The only time they gather keystroke information is when you're in Cortana...which is literally useless without gathering telemetry for search terms. > Microsoft has done just fine with windows without taking all this additional information Except for losing marketshare and people complaining about UX and how OSX is better?
- 10y ago