6 ms·

The data is good. I have been in the auto repair industry (in various forms)for a long time and can attest that the results are correct.

ambicapter 10y ago
Based on your intuition?
- asimuvPR 10y ago
  Not at all. I: Owned and operated various auto repair shops. Including on site repairs similar to YM. Worked as an auto technician across brands. Have a degree in auto repair. Worked as a shop manager at a national repair shop. Worked in commercial, retail and wholesale auto parts sales. In all I have about 20 years of experience. Without mentioning my experience modifying and tuning cars because its not relevant.
chris11 10y ago
Is this accurate for the hybrids? I have a hybrid and I can't find a local independent shop who will work on the hybrid system. I'm wondering if those estimates include data from dealers.
- asimuvPR 10y ago
  The hybrids are very area dependent. Like you have experienced, service shops are not common. Although those things are reliable because the whole hybrid market would have tanked if they were lemons. So they were forced to overengineer them. A win for the consumer.
- kswahl1 10y ago
  Whats wrong with the hybrid system?
  - chris11 10y ago
    I've had a decent amount of work done on my car. But the few bigger repairs were either expected, or unusual and not representative of the model (like the engine work I had to do). And the dealer has given me some significant goodwill discounts. But one thing is that the parts of the hybrid system are different than normal gas cars. The transmission is probably different, and the gas engines are smaller. So most independent shops don't really have experience working on those hybrid-specific parts. Another thing is that the HV batteries don't last forever, and are expensive to replace. And the warranties don't always cover the average life of a battery. The third thing is that hybrid battery is high voltage. So most shops won't want to do any repairs that will touch the HV electrical system. You can find independent mechanics that work on hybrids, hybrid car repair just require a little more specialization than other cars.
esaym 10y ago
So have I and I can say I disagree with most all the data. Take the section "Brands most likely not to start", and you see Mercury at the top. Strange, they only have a couple of models I wonder which it is? So you look at the section "Models most likely not to start", and no Mercury model is even listed. Instead Hyundai is at the top and it wasn't even on the first chart. They seem to really love throwing Mercury under the bus with comments about how the company closed doors (had nothing to do with reliability, people today just don't want 20mpg vehicles) and never mind the several million mercury taxi cabs. And at least with the Grand Marquis, it is nearly bullet proof. Its design has changed very little over the last 20 years and the 4.6L engine will run 400k miles as long as you change the oil. And when something does go wrong, most parts are cheap and easy to replace. And the "Brands that cost the most to maintain" section can be deceiving. For instance Honda is at the bottom making it sound like a good deal. Yet most all Hondas (and most Asian cars) use a timing belt instead of a chain: http://yourcarangel.com/2015/06/honda-timing-belt-timing-chain-list/ http://yourcarangel.com/2015/06/honda-timing-belt-timing-cha... That has to be changed every 50K miles because the risk of it snapping is much higher after that. And if it does snap, you could very well be looking at needing a new top half of your motor. I refuse to buy any car that has a belt instead of a chain. The only advantage is it saves some noise and a little bit of gas. But the disadvantages far out way that.
- foobarqux 10y ago
  So which used models are the cheapest to maintain in your experience? What about total ownership cost?
  - asimuvPR 10y ago
    I only buy toyota vehicles. Our household and immediate family are toyota owners (at least one per household, two at mine). I'm not a fanboy though. The cars are cheap to operate and last a long time. Plus the resale value is decent. They are boring cars though. Absolute appliances. Unless its an scion frs or a high performance lexus (or supra if you can afford it).
  - ArkyBeagle 10y ago
ADent 10y ago
Why is the most expensive BMW listed less than the average cost of BMW?
- mmarx 10y ago
  > Why is the most expensive BMW listed less than the average cost of BMW? “In order to estimate annual maintenance costs, we found the amount spent on every two oil changes (as oil changes are generally done every six months).” The oil change interval on a BMW 328i (F30, the current model) is 10000 miles or 1 year, whichever comes first. For the model from ten years ago (E90), it's as indicated by the engine (with a starting interval of 30000 km, ~18000 miles) or every two years[0]. Hence, the total cost for oil changes will be a lot lower than estimated, and the actual repairs needed in that interval do not make up for that. [0] http://workshop-manuals.com/bmw/3_series_e90/328i_n51_sal/1_service_information/0__maintenance_and_general_data/3_si__harmonisation_of_oil_change_intervals_bmw/ http://workshop-manuals.com/bmw/3_series_e90/328i_n51_sal/1_...

ambicapter 10y ago

Based on your intuition?

asimuvPR 10y ago
Not at all. I: Owned and operated various auto repair shops. Including on site repairs similar to YM. Worked as an auto technician across brands. Have a degree in auto repair. Worked as a shop manager at a national repair shop. Worked in commercial, retail and wholesale auto parts sales. In all I have about 20 years of experience. Without mentioning my experience modifying and tuning cars because its not relevant.

chris11 10y ago

Is this accurate for the hybrids? I have a hybrid and I can't find a local independent shop who will work on the hybrid system. I'm wondering if those estimates include data from dealers.

asimuvPR 10y ago
The hybrids are very area dependent. Like you have experienced, service shops are not common. Although those things are reliable because the whole hybrid market would have tanked if they were lemons. So they were forced to overengineer them. A win for the consumer.
kswahl1 10y ago
Whats wrong with the hybrid system?
- chris11 10y ago
  I've had a decent amount of work done on my car. But the few bigger repairs were either expected, or unusual and not representative of the model (like the engine work I had to do). And the dealer has given me some significant goodwill discounts. But one thing is that the parts of the hybrid system are different than normal gas cars. The transmission is probably different, and the gas engines are smaller. So most independent shops don't really have experience working on those hybrid-specific parts. Another thing is that the HV batteries don't last forever, and are expensive to replace. And the warranties don't always cover the average life of a battery. The third thing is that hybrid battery is high voltage. So most shops won't want to do any repairs that will touch the HV electrical system. You can find independent mechanics that work on hybrids, hybrid car repair just require a little more specialization than other cars.

esaym 10y ago

So have I and I can say I disagree with most all the data. Take the section "Brands most likely not to start", and you see Mercury at the top. Strange, they only have a couple of models I wonder which it is? So you look at the section "Models most likely not to start", and no Mercury model is even listed. Instead Hyundai is at the top and it wasn't even on the first chart. They seem to really love throwing Mercury under the bus with comments about how the company closed doors (had nothing to do with reliability, people today just don't want 20mpg vehicles) and never mind the several million mercury taxi cabs. And at least with the Grand Marquis, it is nearly bullet proof. Its design has changed very little over the last 20 years and the 4.6L engine will run 400k miles as long as you change the oil. And when something does go wrong, most parts are cheap and easy to replace. And the "Brands that cost the most to maintain" section can be deceiving. For instance Honda is at the bottom making it sound like a good deal. Yet most all Hondas (and most Asian cars) use a timing belt instead of a chain: http://yourcarangel.com/2015/06/honda-timing-belt-timing-chain-list/ http://yourcarangel.com/2015/06/honda-timing-belt-timing-cha... That has to be changed every 50K miles because the risk of it snapping is much higher after that. And if it does snap, you could very well be looking at needing a new top half of your motor. I refuse to buy any car that has a belt instead of a chain. The only advantage is it saves some noise and a little bit of gas. But the disadvantages far out way that.

foobarqux 10y ago
So which used models are the cheapest to maintain in your experience? What about total ownership cost?
- asimuvPR 10y ago
  I only buy toyota vehicles. Our household and immediate family are toyota owners (at least one per household, two at mine). I'm not a fanboy though. The cars are cheap to operate and last a long time. Plus the resale value is decent. They are boring cars though. Absolute appliances. Unless its an scion frs or a high performance lexus (or supra if you can afford it).
- ArkyBeagle 10y ago

ADent 10y ago

Why is the most expensive BMW listed less than the average cost of BMW?

mmarx 10y ago
> Why is the most expensive BMW listed less than the average cost of BMW? “In order to estimate annual maintenance costs, we found the amount spent on every two oil changes (as oil changes are generally done every six months).” The oil change interval on a BMW 328i (F30, the current model) is 10000 miles or 1 year, whichever comes first. For the model from ten years ago (E90), it's as indicated by the engine (with a starting interval of 30000 km, ~18000 miles) or every two years[0]. Hence, the total cost for oil changes will be a lot lower than estimated, and the actual repairs needed in that interval do not make up for that. [0] http://workshop-manuals.com/bmw/3_series_e90/328i_n51_sal/1_service_information/0__maintenance_and_general_data/3_si__harmonisation_of_oil_change_intervals_bmw/ http://workshop-manuals.com/bmw/3_series_e90/328i_n51_sal/1_...