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I'm Scottish, and I absolutely detest traveling through Heathrow. The security and border controls there are some of the most oppressive I've ever encountered.

by davb 10y ago

I'm Scottish, and I absolutely detest traveling through Heathrow. The security and border controls there are some of the most oppressive I've ever encountered. Depending on where you're flying, that could include multiple baggage searches and multiple biometric photos (flying OUT of the UK, I counted three - security, a secondary queue before entering the terminal concourse, and at the gate). Questioning why you're being photographed (let alone asking about data retention policies) just invites further scrutiny and questioning. Recently I had my bag emptied (I wasn't allowed to unpack it carefully) and was questioned very rigorously as to why I was carrying so many cables (I had a micro-USB cable to charge my phone, a laptop charger, and an HDMI cable to watch some Netflix at the hotel). I had to justify each item in my bag. The attitude is the worst part. I feel like I'm being treated like a criminal and have to prove that I'm not. Every time I travel in or out, I feel the anxiety rise. It's difficult to explain. That's not to suggest Glasgow Intl Airport is much better. Flying to the US last month, I check-in queues for AA were enormous. Some staff (I assumed they were customer service agents trying to keep the queuing travellers happy) were walking up and down, chatting with people. They cheerily asked "Where are you going?". "Oh that's exciting. Have you been before? I love that city! Did you have to save up much spending money for an 8 day trip? What are you planning to do when you're there?" As the questions went on, I got more suspicious. "What do you do for a living? Oh that sounds exciting. Did you grow up in Glasgow? What about your fiancée, what does she do? Oh, you got engaged in the US? How long was that trip and what did you see when you were there?" At the end, the guy asked for my passport and attached a "Security cleared" sticker to it. I'd been surreptitiously interviewed and subject to behavioural profiling by staff from a contractor named ICTS [1]. It wasn't a good feeling. I felt deceived. It felt like they were putting a friendly face on trying to catch me out. This only seemed to be happening in the AA line, and I've never been subject to this sort of interview in the past. Does this actually work? I'd assume that any determined terrorist or trouble-maker would have a big smile and a well-rehearsed story. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ICTS_International https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ICTS_International

germanier 10y ago
The Israeli government swears by this method. Given the high threat-level and low incident rate one shouldn't say it's ineffective. Honestly, I would rather have such a method than the almost useless security theatre we face at every airport. (After clicking the link I noticed that it's actually founded by former Israeli intelligence workers.)
- davb 10y ago
  I think the threats are a little different here, however. I can understand the need for more compromise somewhere like Israel where there's a very visible and real terror threat. It's perhaps a more applicable system in that environment. We don't have that here - I don't think it's particularly useful given the threat landscape in the UK. Perhaps at the height of the troubles in Northern Ireland, where there was a tangible threat of terrorism. If we're to be interviewed in line by security officers, I'd prefer that they identify themselves as such and make it clear that this is a security screening and not just a friendly chat from a genuinely interested CS agent. To do otherwise just seems deceitful. Edit: To add, while I don't necessarily agree with your assessment, I did upvote your comment - I think it adds to the discussion and provides some valuable perspective.
petercooper 10y ago
At the end, the guy asked for my passport and attached a "Security cleared" sticker to it. FWIW, Virgin has slapped tons of these on my passport without such an interview. They appear to be applied once you have answered the mandatory questions around your baggage (i.e. did you pack it yourself? are there any prohibited items?)
- davb 10y ago
  That's what I initially thought, but he didn't ask anything about my luggage. That would have made it too obvious it was a security interview. We were asked the standard baggage questions by the check-in agent. The ICTS thing was something completely different and new to us. When we got to the gate, the same group of covert screeners were there waiting for us and doing additional screening. I showed my passport to the gate agent, took three steps (past the desk, onto the jet bridge, and had to show it again to ICTS contractor. It seemed ridiculous and redundant. By this point, I'd shown my passport at least five times (ICTS queue interview, check-in desk, security, gate, ICTS again).
  - robjan 10y ago
    The purpose of ICTS process is to establish that you will not be deported from your destination country. When they put the sticker on the passport it means that they are satisfied that you have the correct visa/visa waiver to enter. If you get deported then the airline has to repatriate you at their expense.
    - davb 10y ago
      I don't think so, in this case. We weren't asked anything about completion of an ESTA or API. It definitely felt like more of a security/behavioural screening - not a check on visa or travel eligibility. If this was the case, they'd have made their intentions clear and wouldn't have been at the gate waiting to re-check passengers. Or that check would have been performed at the check-in desk, where they check your eligibility to travel (correct documentation, tickets, etc). I do suspect, however, that they're contracted by the airline. They weren't in any other airline's check-in queue and we've never seen them in the past (this was our first time flying AA).
andy_boot 10y ago
I actually think that's a better way to do it than what we usually have to go through. I believe the Israel uses this technique as well.

by davb 10y ago

germanier 10y ago

The Israeli government swears by this method. Given the high threat-level and low incident rate one shouldn't say it's ineffective. Honestly, I would rather have such a method than the almost useless security theatre we face at every airport. (After clicking the link I noticed that it's actually founded by former Israeli intelligence workers.)

davb 10y ago
I think the threats are a little different here, however. I can understand the need for more compromise somewhere like Israel where there's a very visible and real terror threat. It's perhaps a more applicable system in that environment. We don't have that here - I don't think it's particularly useful given the threat landscape in the UK. Perhaps at the height of the troubles in Northern Ireland, where there was a tangible threat of terrorism. If we're to be interviewed in line by security officers, I'd prefer that they identify themselves as such and make it clear that this is a security screening and not just a friendly chat from a genuinely interested CS agent. To do otherwise just seems deceitful. Edit: To add, while I don't necessarily agree with your assessment, I did upvote your comment - I think it adds to the discussion and provides some valuable perspective.

petercooper 10y ago

At the end, the guy asked for my passport and attached a "Security cleared" sticker to it. FWIW, Virgin has slapped tons of these on my passport without such an interview. They appear to be applied once you have answered the mandatory questions around your baggage (i.e. did you pack it yourself? are there any prohibited items?)

davb 10y ago
That's what I initially thought, but he didn't ask anything about my luggage. That would have made it too obvious it was a security interview. We were asked the standard baggage questions by the check-in agent. The ICTS thing was something completely different and new to us. When we got to the gate, the same group of covert screeners were there waiting for us and doing additional screening. I showed my passport to the gate agent, took three steps (past the desk, onto the jet bridge, and had to show it again to ICTS contractor. It seemed ridiculous and redundant. By this point, I'd shown my passport at least five times (ICTS queue interview, check-in desk, security, gate, ICTS again).
- robjan 10y ago
  The purpose of ICTS process is to establish that you will not be deported from your destination country. When they put the sticker on the passport it means that they are satisfied that you have the correct visa/visa waiver to enter. If you get deported then the airline has to repatriate you at their expense.
  - davb 10y ago
    I don't think so, in this case. We weren't asked anything about completion of an ESTA or API. It definitely felt like more of a security/behavioural screening - not a check on visa or travel eligibility. If this was the case, they'd have made their intentions clear and wouldn't have been at the gate waiting to re-check passengers. Or that check would have been performed at the check-in desk, where they check your eligibility to travel (correct documentation, tickets, etc). I do suspect, however, that they're contracted by the airline. They weren't in any other airline's check-in queue and we've never seen them in the past (this was our first time flying AA).

andy_boot 10y ago

I actually think that's a better way to do it than what we usually have to go through. I believe the Israel uses this technique as well.