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You can absolutely use JavaScript to pull an article into the browser. But if the user doesn't have JavaScript, they should still be able to navigate the site

by ldjb 10y ago

You can absolutely use JavaScript to pull an article into the browser. But if the user doesn't have JavaScript, they should still be able to navigate the site the old-fashioned way. It doesn't have to be one way or the other.

sp332 10y ago
I think the vast majority of people browsing without JS are people who have manually disabled it. Which goes back to my first question: Can we make a JS that's acceptable to those people, so they will just enable it?
- ldjb 10y ago
  I regularly browse the web using Lynx, a text-only browser that doesn't even have a setting to enable JavaScript. There should almost always be fallbacks for people who don't have JavaScript, but if you are going to use JavaScript, it would at least help if any nontrivial code were free, such that it isn't blocked by the LibreJS add-on. At the very least, the user experience with JavaScript enabled should not be worse than with JavaScript disabled.
- Spivak 10y ago
  Compromise and make sure it's served 1st party?
  - sp332 10y ago
    Caches are nice though. Compromise and make sure it's checked against a hash provided by the first party?
    - Spivak 10y ago
      As long as you use subresource integrity we have a deal! I know it's currently experimental but having native browser support is much more palatable than using JS to check the hash.
    - hueving 10y ago
      Then ensure that it can't communicate with the domain it's loaded from.
- pmontra 10y ago
  I don't know if there are stats about disabling JS in the preferences of the browser, but I'm using NoScript. That's a finer grained control. Absolutely no JS would mean almost no web nowadays. Maybe wikipedia works.
- extra88 10y ago
  People using Opera Mini are effectively browsing without JS, I'm sure they outnumber the people turning off JS or using NoScript in other browsers.
- TeMPOraL 10y ago
  It's not the problem of JS, it's what is being done with it. It's about bullshit and bloat, about lazy-ass developers, designers showing off and the web being fashion-driven industry. It's about ads and tracking. The only way to fix it JS-level is to bake a requirement into the standard that the code size limit for JS is 256kb. If a company can't fit their "value-added features" in it, that's their problem.

by ldjb 10y ago

sp332 10y ago

I think the vast majority of people browsing without JS are people who have manually disabled it. Which goes back to my first question: Can we make a JS that's acceptable to those people, so they will just enable it?

ldjb 10y ago
I regularly browse the web using Lynx, a text-only browser that doesn't even have a setting to enable JavaScript. There should almost always be fallbacks for people who don't have JavaScript, but if you are going to use JavaScript, it would at least help if any nontrivial code were free, such that it isn't blocked by the LibreJS add-on. At the very least, the user experience with JavaScript enabled should not be worse than with JavaScript disabled.
Spivak 10y ago
Compromise and make sure it's served 1st party?
- sp332 10y ago
  Caches are nice though. Compromise and make sure it's checked against a hash provided by the first party?
  - Spivak 10y ago
    As long as you use subresource integrity we have a deal! I know it's currently experimental but having native browser support is much more palatable than using JS to check the hash.
  - hueving 10y ago
    Then ensure that it can't communicate with the domain it's loaded from.
pmontra 10y ago
I don't know if there are stats about disabling JS in the preferences of the browser, but I'm using NoScript. That's a finer grained control. Absolutely no JS would mean almost no web nowadays. Maybe wikipedia works.
extra88 10y ago
People using Opera Mini are effectively browsing without JS, I'm sure they outnumber the people turning off JS or using NoScript in other browsers.
TeMPOraL 10y ago
It's not the problem of JS, it's what is being done with it. It's about bullshit and bloat, about lazy-ass developers, designers showing off and the web being fashion-driven industry. It's about ads and tracking. The only way to fix it JS-level is to bake a requirement into the standard that the code size limit for JS is 256kb. If a company can't fit their "value-added features" in it, that's their problem.