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I'm getting a negative tone from this post and I don't really see why. Training is the point of graduate school. That is why we still call them graduate student

by arcanus 10y ago

I'm getting a negative tone from this post and I don't really see why. Training is the point of graduate school. That is why we still call them graduate students. > I thought a PhD was about making an original contribution to my field > the PhD is really more about training in the fundamentals of scholarship You realize that these two concepts are not mutually incompatible? And furthermore, that the former is contingent upon capability in the latter? > as much as it might seem like you are supposed to blaze a path, they really just want you to show that you can walk in a straight line The vast majority of graduate students are not capable of conducting independent research when they start (I certainly was not!). Often, it takes years of training to get them into a state in which they are sufficiently knowledgeable to take a real leadership role. Expecting someone to be capable of independent research would be wasteful: they need more guidance! This is why they are called 'advisers', not bosses. Without them most students would zig off into a direction that is fruitless. However, to suggest that the work you do at this time is meaningless is also wrong. Your adviser almost certainly has funding sources that support the work, and this is likely directed towards productive and meaningful pursuits. The fact that students are not leading these effort is not a detriment, and in my experience even smaller research projects quickly provide amply opportunities for taking initiative. Furthermore, very few students finish a doctorate without writing papers, so I find the notion that there is no actual scholarly contribution inaccurate.

klodolph 10y ago
Hm, that's an interesting reaction. I also don't really see why that you're getting a negative tone. I don't think the post is suggesting that the work is meaningless (as your comment interprets) but rather that the meaning of a PhD is mostly not in the thesis itself, but in the ability to conduct independent research, like you said.
- Retric 10y ago
  In science original research is only original if you don't know the outcome. There is a huge temptation to assume the outcome matters, but as long as you can validate why you looked into something then the outcome should be meaningless. Thus the thesis matter's, but only up to a point. Otherwise you push people to either make things up, or only reward the lucky. PS: Some non science fields have other criteria, but they are not experimenting.
sevensor 10y ago
> Your adviser almost certainly has funding sources that support the work, This depends a lot on the advisor and the field. I just wrapped up an engineering Ph.D., which I came within inches of bailing on. While I had funding for the first four years, it was for unrelated work. For the last two years, I got a job outside of the university. All I got from my advisor in terms of support for my doctoral research was access to the computing resources I needed.
erikpukinskis 10y ago
No negative tone intended. I genuinely wish I had understood this about Academia so I could've maybe made different decisions.

by arcanus 10y ago

klodolph 10y ago

Hm, that's an interesting reaction. I also don't really see why that you're getting a negative tone. I don't think the post is suggesting that the work is meaningless (as your comment interprets) but rather that the meaning of a PhD is mostly not in the thesis itself, but in the ability to conduct independent research, like you said.

Retric 10y ago
In science original research is only original if you don't know the outcome. There is a huge temptation to assume the outcome matters, but as long as you can validate why you looked into something then the outcome should be meaningless. Thus the thesis matter's, but only up to a point. Otherwise you push people to either make things up, or only reward the lucky. PS: Some non science fields have other criteria, but they are not experimenting.

sevensor 10y ago

> Your adviser almost certainly has funding sources that support the work, This depends a lot on the advisor and the field. I just wrapped up an engineering Ph.D., which I came within inches of bailing on. While I had funding for the first four years, it was for unrelated work. For the last two years, I got a job outside of the university. All I got from my advisor in terms of support for my doctoral research was access to the computing resources I needed.

erikpukinskis 10y ago

No negative tone intended. I genuinely wish I had understood this about Academia so I could've maybe made different decisions.