3 ms·

Do you have a problem with a world where those who oppose homosexual activity, corporations and racists are socially shunned and economically excluded? Yes. I

Do you have a problem with a world where those who oppose homosexual activity, corporations and racists are socially shunned and economically excluded? Yes. I haven't reached epistemic closure. (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/28/books/28conserv.html?_r=1 http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/28/books/28conserv.html?_r=1 if you are unfamiliar.) I believe we may be incorrect about a variety of things we currently believe - we have not yet reached the pinnacle of human knowledge. In order to discover places where we currently are wrong, we need to be tolerant of people expressing dissenting points of view. For this purpose, preventing a (possibly correct) dissenting view from being expressed via social ostracism is just as harmful as preventing it via force of arms.

zeveb 10y ago
> In order to discover places where we currently are wrong, we need to be tolerant of people expressing dissenting points of view. I agree, but I distinguish between tolerance & acceptance. Tolerance means you do your thing & I do my thing; acceptance means we do the same thing. The problem is, if we each have opposing ideas of the good then we can't accept one another's ideas. Acceptance of opposing ideas can only really work by pretending that the ideas themselves don't matter, but tolerance can respect the importance of the ideas themselves while agreeing to disagree.
- yummyfajitas 10y ago
  I'm not suggesting you should accept my ideas that you believe are wrong. I'm suggesting that you should prove yourself correct rather than simply making me afraid to speak. If your ideas are correct, why is that so difficult?
isleyaardvark 10y ago
You haven't reached epistemic closure on racism? Donald Sterling's comments: "It bothers me a lot that you want to broadcast that you're associating with black people", and, "You can sleep with [black people]. You can bring them in, you can do whatever you want", but "the little I ask you is ... not to bring them to my games" - you haven't reached epistemic closure on that?
- isleyaardvark 10y ago
  I guess I'll take that as a "no".
- isleyaardvark 10y ago
  The downvotes are particularly hypocritical and self-serving. I guess tolerance of "of people expressing dissenting points of view" has particular requirements.

zeveb 10y ago

> In order to discover places where we currently are wrong, we need to be tolerant of people expressing dissenting points of view. I agree, but I distinguish between tolerance & acceptance. Tolerance means you do your thing & I do my thing; acceptance means we do the same thing. The problem is, if we each have opposing ideas of the good then we can't accept one another's ideas. Acceptance of opposing ideas can only really work by pretending that the ideas themselves don't matter, but tolerance can respect the importance of the ideas themselves while agreeing to disagree.

yummyfajitas 10y ago
I'm not suggesting you should accept my ideas that you believe are wrong. I'm suggesting that you should prove yourself correct rather than simply making me afraid to speak. If your ideas are correct, why is that so difficult?

isleyaardvark 10y ago

You haven't reached epistemic closure on racism? Donald Sterling's comments: "It bothers me a lot that you want to broadcast that you're associating with black people", and, "You can sleep with [black people]. You can bring them in, you can do whatever you want", but "the little I ask you is ... not to bring them to my games" - you haven't reached epistemic closure on that?

isleyaardvark 10y ago
I guess I'll take that as a "no".
isleyaardvark 10y ago
The downvotes are particularly hypocritical and self-serving. I guess tolerance of "of people expressing dissenting points of view" has particular requirements.