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FTA: “Regions have an outlive relation defined on them.” Typo? Should that be outlives? We say equality, inequality, equivalence (equal valence, i.e. value) re

FTA: “Regions have an outlive relation defined on them.” Typo? Should that be outlives? We say equality, inequality, equivalence (equal valence, i.e. value) relation. To be equal -> equality. To outlive -> ? Valid question, outlives doesn't quite fit? To exceed the lifetime, to go beyond the region -> an excession relation, an overboundedness relation? I jest (in part). Naming things is hard! One of the two hard things in programming, as they say. > Suggest a better alternative and prove that we should throw away decades worth of papers and start using your new terminology. “outlives or equals to” -> “outlives or is equal to in scope/duration” reads better to my ears. So it's not even to outlive, it's to live for the same amount as or outlive. GP has valid language use concerns. And yes, abstract algebra is esoteric. ps: The Trump swipe is crass.

sklogic 10y ago
Ok, I see, 'outlives' is much better. But I guess he's complaining about the very choice of the relationship names, not nitpicking about grammar. > abstract algebra is esoteric. How is it so? It's fundamental and essential. "Esoteric" implies "mostly useless", which is definitely not true.
- igravious 10y ago
  Cool. No way am I saying that abstract algebra is mostly useless, not at all. There's another sense for `esoteric'[2] which means hidden (or secret?) or highly specialised[0] or rare or unconventional. Which I think is what is being got at here, a sort of math-cult[1] if you will :) [0] http://www.thefreedictionary.com/esoterica http://www.thefreedictionary.com/esoterica [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_esotericism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_esotericism [2] http://www.thefreedictionary.com/esoteric http://www.thefreedictionary.com/esoteric edit: I agree, abstract algebra is fundamental, beautiful, and essential - but in fairness, it is highly domain specific and if Rust's type system can be explained as exactly and succinctly with terms closer to home thenwe ought to give it a shot
  - sklogic 10y ago
    > it is highly domain specific It is "domain specific" to pretty much all the domains in existence.
jcrites 10y ago
Outlive -> Outlivity? :-) I think talking about the "outlives" relation is reasonably clear. "A outlives B (written B < A) if ...". The relation for <= could be written "outlives or is equal to", or "lives at least as long as". Thus "B <= A" could be spoken "A lives at least as long as B", or "A outlives or is equal to B".

sklogic 10y ago

Ok, I see, 'outlives' is much better. But I guess he's complaining about the very choice of the relationship names, not nitpicking about grammar. > abstract algebra is esoteric. How is it so? It's fundamental and essential. "Esoteric" implies "mostly useless", which is definitely not true.

igravious 10y ago
Cool. No way am I saying that abstract algebra is mostly useless, not at all. There's another sense for `esoteric'[2] which means hidden (or secret?) or highly specialised[0] or rare or unconventional. Which I think is what is being got at here, a sort of math-cult[1] if you will :) [0] http://www.thefreedictionary.com/esoterica http://www.thefreedictionary.com/esoterica [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_esotericism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_esotericism [2] http://www.thefreedictionary.com/esoteric http://www.thefreedictionary.com/esoteric edit: I agree, abstract algebra is fundamental, beautiful, and essential - but in fairness, it is highly domain specific and if Rust's type system can be explained as exactly and succinctly with terms closer to home thenwe ought to give it a shot
- sklogic 10y ago
  > it is highly domain specific It is "domain specific" to pretty much all the domains in existence.

jcrites 10y ago

Outlive -> Outlivity? :-) I think talking about the "outlives" relation is reasonably clear. "A outlives B (written B < A) if ...". The relation for <= could be written "outlives or is equal to", or "lives at least as long as". Thus "B <= A" could be spoken "A lives at least as long as B", or "A outlives or is equal to B".