4 ms·

1) sandboxed apps. Concept isn't new, but consumer PCs have never had sandboxes. A game or word processor you install shouldn't have access to your tax returns.

by gizmo 17y ago

1) sandboxed apps. Concept isn't new, but consumer PCs have never had sandboxes. A game or word processor you install shouldn't have access to your tax returns. With the iPad nasty apps can't do much damage. 2) backup app installations, settings and documents by syncing with iTunes. iPad breaks or gets stolen? Buy a new one and plug it back in and you're back in business. 3) App Store. Now only used for "gimmick" software on the iPhone, but the potential is enormous. Only apt-get comes close, but apt-get doesn't have an easy payment model. And it has this dependecy-hell and installing updates can wreck havoc. 4) computer with built-in GPS & accelerometer and 3G internet. How many laptops have that? 5) locked-down and DRMed, even for developers. That's certainly revolutionary for a consumer PC. 6) No tree based filesystem. No /home/[user]/Documents, no c:\Users\[user]\AppData. Your files are just "there".

kprobst 17y ago
> locked-down and DRMed, even for developers. That's certainly revolutionary for a consumer PC. Well that's certainly one way to spin that.
- gizmo 17y ago
  Revolutions aren't by definition a good thing, you know.
jacquesm 17y ago
> 1) sandboxed apps. Concept isn't new, but consumer PCs have never had sandboxes. A game or word processor you install shouldn't have access to your tax returns. With the iPad nasty apps can't do much damage. Sandboxes as a concept aren't new, and so are not revolutionary. Consumer PC's have had sandboxes every since you've been able to run a java programs within a browser. > 2) backup app installations, settings and documents by syncing with iTunes. iPad breaks or gets stolen? Buy a new one and plug it back in and you're back in business. That's a neat feature, but not a 'make-or-break' thing. Nice to have, not revolutionary. > 3) App Store. Now only used for "gimmick" software on the iPhone, but the potential is enormous. Only apt-get comes close, but apt-get doesn't have an easy payment model. And it has this dependecy-hell and installing updates can wreck havoc. Apt-gets strength is that there is no payment model, access to lots of high quality software for the sum of $0. That's not a weakness, that's a strength. Iphone apps in general are trivial, with the occasional exception. There is an enormous body of real world, non-trivial software in the apt-get (and yum) repositories. The potential is there to re-ignite a new closed source era, and that's definitely not revolutionary. > 4) computer with built-in GPS & accelerometer and 3G internet. How many laptops have that? My netbook has all those except for the accelerometer, it runs Ubuntu notebook remix and works pretty good. It also has access to the above mentioned apt-get repositories. > 5) locked-down and DRMed, even for developers. That's certainly revolutionary for a consumer PC. That's a complete loss, not revolutionary. Trusted computing through the backdoor. If microsoft were to do something like this there would be shrunken heads on stakes. We definitely wouldn't call it revolutionary. > 6) No tree based filesystem. No /home/[user]/Documents, no c:\Users\[user]\AppData. Your files are just "there". I can see how that would be useful if you only have a relatively small number of files. But here on my collective drives there are literally 10's of millions of files. Just being worried about namespace collisions as well as forgetting what a file is named, I usually can find it because my directory structure is organized. I can see how tagging would go a long way towards mitigating that, but the 'tree' based file system works quite well because that happens to be how we normally organize documents. If the lack of something is revolutionary then I invite you to store all your files in the root directory of your harddrive.
- stcredzero 17y ago
  Sandboxes as a concept aren't new, and so are not revolutionary. You have a huge misconception here. Revolutionary tech takes decades to be fully absorbed by the culture. Or was the Internet not revolutionary because Minitel Videotext terminals were in front of the general public years before it was?
  - jacquesm 17y ago
    There is a bit of a split I think. The moment when some technology is invented vs the moment when as the result of that technology some revolution happens are not the same, but we can speak about a 'revolutionary invention' as well as the actual revolution without getting mixed up. So, Minitel, which in turn was a turnkey terminal version of the videotex standard was revolutionary in the sense that it allowed a whole country (France) to use online services. But the real revolution came when the world wide web allowed everybody to publish and consume content. The videotex services made a big thing out of being an 'information provider' and a 'consumer', which of course suited the telcos that deployed these devices just perfect. It never crossed their minds that the unwashed masses would want to publish their own content. The internet pre-dates the minitel system by about a decade by the way. But the world-wide-web, a relatively simple layer on top of the internet is about as revolutionary a change as we've had since the electronics revolution and the advent of personal computing.
    - stcredzero 17y ago
      The internet pre-dates the minitel system by about a decade by the way. I'm aware of that. I'm a bit older than most suspect.
- Zev 17y ago
  The potential is there to re-ignite a new closed source era, and that's definitely not revolutionary. Just because the app runs on the iPhone or iPad doesn't mean it has to be closed source. I can see how that would be useful if you only have a relatively small number of files. But here on my collective drives there are literally 10's of millions of files... I think the point is that the iPad manages this for you. You just have to remember that you made a document in Pages and the name of it. You don't need to worry about folders or where it was saved to. That doesn't mean a single, flat directory. Just that users don't have to manage files. FWIW, while I personally think that the iPad will be an extraordinary change in how the average person uses a computer, I would agree with you that the future isn't set in stone and the only way to know for sure is to wait and see.
theli0nheart 17y ago
Apple is a famous company. But this doesn't mean that they deserve credit for all of this awesome stuff. They're building on the shoulders of giants and to deny that is a pretty bold thing. 1) Should is a very subjective term. What if I track my taxes in my Word Processor? 2) Doesn't Dropbox do this? And isn't this what git/hg do for developers? 3) The Internet is a much bigger and better app store. 4) So if I made a computer with built-in GPS, accelerometer, 3G Internet, AND a CD drive, would that be "revolutionary" too? I think not. Adding more a more features that already exist make not an idea revolutionary. 5) Since when did Orwellian DRMs become revolutionary? 6) Just because you can't see it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Because the iPad most definitely has a filesystem.
- stcredzero 17y ago
  So if I made a computer with built-in GPS, accelerometer, 3G Internet, AND a CD drive, would that be "revolutionary" too? Actually, yes, possibly. But that doesn't necessarily mean it would be commercially successful. The Internet is a much bigger and better app store. Define "better." I feel a lot safer on the App Store. But I note I can do a heck of a lot more with my jailbroken iPhone thanks to a few select apps not available there. The valuable realization here is that one should be able to have the cake and eat it too.
- gizmo 17y ago
  Just listing the ways in which iPad is significantly different from everything else out there. Whether the differences turn out to be a big deal remains to be seen. 1) That's nitpicking. A video game shouldn't have access to your important files, and that's something Mac and PC get "wrong", and iPad gets "right". 2) Nope. If your computer breaks you have to reinstall it, and then reinstall Dropbox and then you get only files back from a single directory. We developers have solutions for every problem, but that's irrelevant for the public at large. 3) For some value of "better". Either way, it's still a big change from the status quo, hence revolutionary. 4) Fair enough. 5) If it's not revolutionary, what would you call it? If because of the iPad the future of personal computing is DRM-ed then I'd say that's a major, major revolution. 6) From a consumer perspective that's exactly what it means. If you can't see it, it ain't there.

by gizmo 17y ago

kprobst 17y ago

> locked-down and DRMed, even for developers. That's certainly revolutionary for a consumer PC. Well that's certainly one way to spin that.

gizmo 17y ago
Revolutions aren't by definition a good thing, you know.

jacquesm 17y ago

> 1) sandboxed apps. Concept isn't new, but consumer PCs have never had sandboxes. A game or word processor you install shouldn't have access to your tax returns. With the iPad nasty apps can't do much damage. Sandboxes as a concept aren't new, and so are not revolutionary. Consumer PC's have had sandboxes every since you've been able to run a java programs within a browser. > 2) backup app installations, settings and documents by syncing with iTunes. iPad breaks or gets stolen? Buy a new one and plug it back in and you're back in business. That's a neat feature, but not a 'make-or-break' thing. Nice to have, not revolutionary. > 3) App Store. Now only used for "gimmick" software on the iPhone, but the potential is enormous. Only apt-get comes close, but apt-get doesn't have an easy payment model. And it has this dependecy-hell and installing updates can wreck havoc. Apt-gets strength is that there is no payment model, access to lots of high quality software for the sum of $0. That's not a weakness, that's a strength. Iphone apps in general are trivial, with the occasional exception. There is an enormous body of real world, non-trivial software in the apt-get (and yum) repositories. The potential is there to re-ignite a new closed source era, and that's definitely not revolutionary. > 4) computer with built-in GPS & accelerometer and 3G internet. How many laptops have that? My netbook has all those except for the accelerometer, it runs Ubuntu notebook remix and works pretty good. It also has access to the above mentioned apt-get repositories. > 5) locked-down and DRMed, even for developers. That's certainly revolutionary for a consumer PC. That's a complete loss, not revolutionary. Trusted computing through the backdoor. If microsoft were to do something like this there would be shrunken heads on stakes. We definitely wouldn't call it revolutionary. > 6) No tree based filesystem. No /home/[user]/Documents, no c:\Users\[user]\AppData. Your files are just "there". I can see how that would be useful if you only have a relatively small number of files. But here on my collective drives there are literally 10's of millions of files. Just being worried about namespace collisions as well as forgetting what a file is named, I usually can find it because my directory structure is organized. I can see how tagging would go a long way towards mitigating that, but the 'tree' based file system works quite well because that happens to be how we normally organize documents. If the lack of something is revolutionary then I invite you to store all your files in the root directory of your harddrive.

stcredzero 17y ago
Sandboxes as a concept aren't new, and so are not revolutionary. You have a huge misconception here. Revolutionary tech takes decades to be fully absorbed by the culture. Or was the Internet not revolutionary because Minitel Videotext terminals were in front of the general public years before it was?
- jacquesm 17y ago
  There is a bit of a split I think. The moment when some technology is invented vs the moment when as the result of that technology some revolution happens are not the same, but we can speak about a 'revolutionary invention' as well as the actual revolution without getting mixed up. So, Minitel, which in turn was a turnkey terminal version of the videotex standard was revolutionary in the sense that it allowed a whole country (France) to use online services. But the real revolution came when the world wide web allowed everybody to publish and consume content. The videotex services made a big thing out of being an 'information provider' and a 'consumer', which of course suited the telcos that deployed these devices just perfect. It never crossed their minds that the unwashed masses would want to publish their own content. The internet pre-dates the minitel system by about a decade by the way. But the world-wide-web, a relatively simple layer on top of the internet is about as revolutionary a change as we've had since the electronics revolution and the advent of personal computing.
  - stcredzero 17y ago
    The internet pre-dates the minitel system by about a decade by the way. I'm aware of that. I'm a bit older than most suspect.
Zev 17y ago
The potential is there to re-ignite a new closed source era, and that's definitely not revolutionary. Just because the app runs on the iPhone or iPad doesn't mean it has to be closed source. I can see how that would be useful if you only have a relatively small number of files. But here on my collective drives there are literally 10's of millions of files... I think the point is that the iPad manages this for you. You just have to remember that you made a document in Pages and the name of it. You don't need to worry about folders or where it was saved to. That doesn't mean a single, flat directory. Just that users don't have to manage files. FWIW, while I personally think that the iPad will be an extraordinary change in how the average person uses a computer, I would agree with you that the future isn't set in stone and the only way to know for sure is to wait and see.

theli0nheart 17y ago

Apple is a famous company. But this doesn't mean that they deserve credit for all of this awesome stuff. They're building on the shoulders of giants and to deny that is a pretty bold thing. 1) Should is a very subjective term. What if I track my taxes in my Word Processor? 2) Doesn't Dropbox do this? And isn't this what git/hg do for developers? 3) The Internet is a much bigger and better app store. 4) So if I made a computer with built-in GPS, accelerometer, 3G Internet, AND a CD drive, would that be "revolutionary" too? I think not. Adding more a more features that already exist make not an idea revolutionary. 5) Since when did Orwellian DRMs become revolutionary? 6) Just because you can't see it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Because the iPad most definitely has a filesystem.

stcredzero 17y ago
So if I made a computer with built-in GPS, accelerometer, 3G Internet, AND a CD drive, would that be "revolutionary" too? Actually, yes, possibly. But that doesn't necessarily mean it would be commercially successful. The Internet is a much bigger and better app store. Define "better." I feel a lot safer on the App Store. But I note I can do a heck of a lot more with my jailbroken iPhone thanks to a few select apps not available there. The valuable realization here is that one should be able to have the cake and eat it too.
gizmo 17y ago
Just listing the ways in which iPad is significantly different from everything else out there. Whether the differences turn out to be a big deal remains to be seen. 1) That's nitpicking. A video game shouldn't have access to your important files, and that's something Mac and PC get "wrong", and iPad gets "right". 2) Nope. If your computer breaks you have to reinstall it, and then reinstall Dropbox and then you get only files back from a single directory. We developers have solutions for every problem, but that's irrelevant for the public at large. 3) For some value of "better". Either way, it's still a big change from the status quo, hence revolutionary. 4) Fair enough. 5) If it's not revolutionary, what would you call it? If because of the iPad the future of personal computing is DRM-ed then I'd say that's a major, major revolution. 6) From a consumer perspective that's exactly what it means. If you can't see it, it ain't there.