4 ms·

Why do we let people sell us cynicism? What benefit is it to us? Does it make you feel better for not pursuing your dream of travelling? Maybe the problem is

Why do we let people sell us cynicism? What benefit is it to us? Does it make you feel better for not pursuing your dream of travelling? Maybe the problem is you and not your lack of trust fund. For about $5000 a person, my friends and I bought a car in California, shipped it to London and drove to China. I was poor at the time and put most of it on a credit card. I also kept my job-- I saved up 3.5 weeks of vacation and lobbied my boss to give me a few extra days on top to give me a full month out. It was one of the best times of my life and something I always love to reflect on. I guess what I'm upset about is, along with this article, no matter what you say there will be people trying to convince all of us that we can't have a happy life without a trust fund. Not Madison Ave... people on these forums. 'Not everybody has $XXX', 'Not everbody is as lucky..'. Shut up. Either start pursuing your dreams or shut up. Stop bringing everybody down with you. Travelling the world is a series of small easy steps that anyone can do. It's vile to try and convince people otherwise.

turar 10y ago
Well, you can start with the fact that being able to dart from country to country without first begging for a visa at the consulate of each country is a huge privilege in itself.
- stevecalifornia 10y ago
  We did have to get visas at any country that spoke Russian or Chinese which was about eight.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
  - turar 10y ago
    It might be hard to explain, but the process and odds of an American/Westerner getting a Russian or a Chinese or an Indian visa are not quite the same as the other way around. But again, to truly understand one needs to be a non-Westerner.
jvagner 10y ago
I totally agree with you. What this NYer article should have done is depantsed the fake Instagram pushers who do have trust-funds or well heeled partners. The dream is really difficult for those who've gone past a certain point in the debt cycle, but with a bit of discipline and wisdom, you can clear your current situation and Live Differently. But that will seem, and quite possibly be, impossible for a lot of people with less flexible/resolvable life circumstances. Same goes for health.
theseatoms 10y ago
> Either start pursuing your dreams or shut up. In all of these articles and discussions, there's this lingering, implicit assumption that everyone dreams of "travelling the world," which is one of the vaguest and least creative dreams I can possibly imagine.
- goda90 10y ago
  I found this article on that idea interesting: http://www.artofmanliness.com/2016/05/31/against-the-cult-of-travel-or-what-everyone-gets-wrong-about-the-hobbit/ http://www.artofmanliness.com/2016/05/31/against-the-cult-of...
- return0 10y ago
  People are a curious restless species though. It used to be conquest/colonies that would drive people away. The aristocrats considered it de rigeur to tour europe on their trust fund equivalents, often bringing western ideas with them. Traveling for leisure is indeed becoming the un-creative thing to do. And it's largely an artifically created dream. Wonder if there are ways to make it more meaningful.
jkern 10y ago
I think you're missing the point of this. To me it reads as a satire of un-selfaware privileged people and facile, feel-good travelogues. You can certainly be a traveler without being/doing either of those
- benten10 10y ago
  I think you're missing what's happening here. This is a place full of exactly the people being satire: the self-awareness-lacking privileged people, as you say. They're being defensive of their choices, and arguing that they're not privileged at all, and anyone can do it, 'as long as they have the money and a job, which anyone can have', completely missing the irony.
vonklaus 10y ago
i think the article is meant to underscore actual travelers who are curious and authentic stand in stark contrast to what amounts to a trustafarian extended vacation. While there is nothing inherently wrong with either, the ladder tends to oversell their cultural immersion and misadventure (at least in stereotypes) while calling great attention to the experience. I do think that does somewhat cheapen it for the people who do what you mention above and travel & experience are very inportant goals it took a long time to plan and save for
unprepare 10y ago
>Maybe the problem is you and not your lack of trust fund. says the guy who took a 4 week paid vacation. most americans dont get ANY paid vacation, those who do often cannot accrue it over time. you got to return to a job you kept, a home you likely kept, health care coverage that never ended, etc etc. this is simply not possible for the vast majority of people, your pull yourself up by your bootstraps argument mightve held weight if you werent an outlier.
- thatfrenchguy 10y ago
  How do you think other countries got paid vacation ? Mostly by electing nice politicians and going out in the street. But American people prefer Clinton and Trump, lol.
  - advantark 10y ago
    Americans really do not prefer either candidate. Our political system is deeply screwed up. Saying something like "Just vote for the right people and everything will be better!" doesn't help us Americans because the system is both a two-party system and is heavily influenced by the rich. The two problems combined has really made our country less of a democracy and more of an oligarchy.
- jayess 10y ago
  Most Americans don't get any paid vacation? Source?
  - alistairSH 10y ago
    The US is unique among OECD nations, in that it does not have any (as in zero) mandatory days off. Not a single national holiday and no required vacation.[1] Roughly 23% of Americans get no paid leave.[2] Furthermore, that 23% is almost exclusively located in the lower wage range. Vacation truly is a luxury for the rich in the United States. [1]http://bigthink.com/praxis/why-do-americans-have-less-vacation-than-anyone-else http://bigthink.com/praxis/why-do-americans-have-less-vacati... [2]http://www.epi.org/publication/millions-of-working-people-dont-get-paid-time-off-for-holidays-or-vacation/ http://www.epi.org/publication/millions-of-working-people-do...
thatfrenchguy 10y ago
This has a terrible environmental impact. For 1000€ you could have bought a car in any European country (but you'd have to learn how to drive a manual, hard for a 'merican)
banku_brougham 10y ago
Thanks for the reality check. Come to think of it, I met a Japanese duo during a vacation. They were young, and traveled by land from Vietnam as far as Kenya at the time I met them. They were very careful with money and didn't spend a lot. They hitchhiked through the Sudan on a freight truck. Wow! That is not something I would ever do, but I will criticize people for falling for the cynical belief that only the rich can have a good life.
smilingtom 10y ago
You got to take a 4 week vacation from work and YOU GOT PAID FOR IT. That you would say "Maybe the problem is you and not your lack of trust fund" is absolutely hilarious. You think everyone is as spoiled as you with free months of salary? Sorry to shatter your world view....

turar 10y ago

Well, you can start with the fact that being able to dart from country to country without first begging for a visa at the consulate of each country is a huge privilege in itself.

stevecalifornia 10y ago
We did have to get visas at any country that spoke Russian or Chinese which was about eight.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- turar 10y ago
  It might be hard to explain, but the process and odds of an American/Westerner getting a Russian or a Chinese or an Indian visa are not quite the same as the other way around. But again, to truly understand one needs to be a non-Westerner.

jvagner 10y ago

I totally agree with you. What this NYer article should have done is depantsed the fake Instagram pushers who do have trust-funds or well heeled partners. The dream is really difficult for those who've gone past a certain point in the debt cycle, but with a bit of discipline and wisdom, you can clear your current situation and Live Differently. But that will seem, and quite possibly be, impossible for a lot of people with less flexible/resolvable life circumstances. Same goes for health.

theseatoms 10y ago

> Either start pursuing your dreams or shut up. In all of these articles and discussions, there's this lingering, implicit assumption that everyone dreams of "travelling the world," which is one of the vaguest and least creative dreams I can possibly imagine.

goda90 10y ago
I found this article on that idea interesting: http://www.artofmanliness.com/2016/05/31/against-the-cult-of-travel-or-what-everyone-gets-wrong-about-the-hobbit/ http://www.artofmanliness.com/2016/05/31/against-the-cult-of...
return0 10y ago
People are a curious restless species though. It used to be conquest/colonies that would drive people away. The aristocrats considered it de rigeur to tour europe on their trust fund equivalents, often bringing western ideas with them. Traveling for leisure is indeed becoming the un-creative thing to do. And it's largely an artifically created dream. Wonder if there are ways to make it more meaningful.

jkern 10y ago

I think you're missing the point of this. To me it reads as a satire of un-selfaware privileged people and facile, feel-good travelogues. You can certainly be a traveler without being/doing either of those

benten10 10y ago
I think you're missing what's happening here. This is a place full of exactly the people being satire: the self-awareness-lacking privileged people, as you say. They're being defensive of their choices, and arguing that they're not privileged at all, and anyone can do it, 'as long as they have the money and a job, which anyone can have', completely missing the irony.

vonklaus 10y ago

i think the article is meant to underscore actual travelers who are curious and authentic stand in stark contrast to what amounts to a trustafarian extended vacation. While there is nothing inherently wrong with either, the ladder tends to oversell their cultural immersion and misadventure (at least in stereotypes) while calling great attention to the experience. I do think that does somewhat cheapen it for the people who do what you mention above and travel & experience are very inportant goals it took a long time to plan and save for

unprepare 10y ago

>Maybe the problem is you and not your lack of trust fund. says the guy who took a 4 week paid vacation. most americans dont get ANY paid vacation, those who do often cannot accrue it over time. you got to return to a job you kept, a home you likely kept, health care coverage that never ended, etc etc. this is simply not possible for the vast majority of people, your pull yourself up by your bootstraps argument mightve held weight if you werent an outlier.

thatfrenchguy 10y ago
How do you think other countries got paid vacation ? Mostly by electing nice politicians and going out in the street. But American people prefer Clinton and Trump, lol.
- advantark 10y ago
  Americans really do not prefer either candidate. Our political system is deeply screwed up. Saying something like "Just vote for the right people and everything will be better!" doesn't help us Americans because the system is both a two-party system and is heavily influenced by the rich. The two problems combined has really made our country less of a democracy and more of an oligarchy.
jayess 10y ago
Most Americans don't get any paid vacation? Source?
- alistairSH 10y ago
  The US is unique among OECD nations, in that it does not have any (as in zero) mandatory days off. Not a single national holiday and no required vacation.[1] Roughly 23% of Americans get no paid leave.[2] Furthermore, that 23% is almost exclusively located in the lower wage range. Vacation truly is a luxury for the rich in the United States. [1]http://bigthink.com/praxis/why-do-americans-have-less-vacation-than-anyone-else http://bigthink.com/praxis/why-do-americans-have-less-vacati... [2]http://www.epi.org/publication/millions-of-working-people-dont-get-paid-time-off-for-holidays-or-vacation/ http://www.epi.org/publication/millions-of-working-people-do...

thatfrenchguy 10y ago

This has a terrible environmental impact. For 1000€ you could have bought a car in any European country (but you'd have to learn how to drive a manual, hard for a 'merican)

banku_brougham 10y ago

Thanks for the reality check. Come to think of it, I met a Japanese duo during a vacation. They were young, and traveled by land from Vietnam as far as Kenya at the time I met them. They were very careful with money and didn't spend a lot. They hitchhiked through the Sudan on a freight truck. Wow! That is not something I would ever do, but I will criticize people for falling for the cynical belief that only the rich can have a good life.

smilingtom 10y ago

You got to take a 4 week vacation from work and YOU GOT PAID FOR IT. That you would say "Maybe the problem is you and not your lack of trust fund" is absolutely hilarious. You think everyone is as spoiled as you with free months of salary? Sorry to shatter your world view....