4 ms·

Welch does hit it on the head. The current US system is nothing like a free market, and it sucks. France's system (and Germany's) sucks rather less than the U

Welch does hit it on the head. The current US system is nothing like a free market, and it sucks. France's system (and Germany's) sucks rather less than the UK's or Canada's - or the US's. I'd advocate for a freer health care market, but that's not on the table. In lieu of that, I'd advocate a more French-style system, but that's not on the table. So, I generally just sit health care debates out, aside from talking side issues with people.

froo 17y ago
I have issues relating to other's health care problems. I suppose here in Australia we're spoiled. For example. I have the best private health coverage I could find and I pay less than $130 a month AUD; but it doesn't stop there. We still have a free health care system if you're ok with waiting for major ops. In terms of what it would cost me for a GP visit. My current GP costs about $20 a visit but often I can claim the majority back with our Medicare Bulk Billing system (not to be confused with the US Medicare.) Our system seems to work extraordinarily well. Those who want to pay for health care can (like I do, it's not that expensive) ... those who can't afford too are still covered by our free system.
- xenophanes 17y ago
  One thing you don't mention is the cost of the "free" system. Remember, TANSTAAFL.
  - deleted 17y ago
    [deleted]
  - froo 17y ago
    Oops, sorry I wrote the comment when I woke up in the middle of the night. Ok, Medicare in Australia is a funded by an income tax levy that every Australian pays, set at 1.5%. It's an almost paltry sum of money when you consider it's free healthcare. My private health insurance also receives a rebate from the Australian Government. From what little I understand about the system, the Australian Government funds this out of my Medicare levy I pay, so that I'm not paying twice. We also have plenty of other medical programs running in Australia - like the Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme which helps low income people afford the medications they require. I'm not up on the numbers, but I think it caps the costs of certain medications at about $5 It works well, I don't know too many people that complain about our system at all. The cost of health care certainly isn't an issue at all that weighs on too many peoples minds
  - DennisP 17y ago
    But there is such a thing as a cheap lunch. The U.S. spends a much higher percentage of its GDP for healthcare than any other country, at 17 percent.
jmackinn 17y ago
Could you elaborate on why the UK's and Canada's health care systems suck?
- Semiapies 17y ago
  Not to snark, but there's a great deal of material on both subjects readily available, and I'm not interested in getting into an argument with a random Canadian or Brit who says eir health care is just awesome. (Hell, my health insurance and health care is pretty awesome, but that can't be generalized to US health care.)
  - marshallp 17y ago
    The data says the average brit lives longer and healthier than americans, and the fact that anyone, including temporary visitors can get free healthcare in britain is 'awesome' from the viewpoint of 'humanity' compared to the travesty that is american healthcare.
    - Semiapies 17y ago
      That one sentence has quite a bit wrong and not even wrong about it, and that's before I even get to your implicit demand that I defend the US health care system against your boosterism of the British NHS. This is why I don't argue for or against health care reform.
      - marshallp 17y ago
        There's "material" to support every side of the argument. The only honest data you have are simple measures like life expectancy and costs as percentage of gdp. Universal healthcare clearly trumps any other system in those. Of course the systems aren't perfect, but they're the best of the alternatives.
        Semiapies 17y ago
        I don't actually have to be here for this argument with you, right? :) Oh, Hell, I'll throw you a bone: what happens to comparative life expectancy numbers when you correct for differing definitions of live birth in the US and the UK? Now, carry on.
maxharris 17y ago
"So, I generally just sit health care debates out, aside from talking side issues with people." So you can't see past the political concretes of today, and you are powerless to influence the future. Some agent for change you are!
- Semiapies 17y ago
  I'll note that I said nothing of the sort, and I've given you no cause to get personal or misguidedly smug with me.

froo 17y ago

I have issues relating to other's health care problems. I suppose here in Australia we're spoiled. For example. I have the best private health coverage I could find and I pay less than $130 a month AUD; but it doesn't stop there. We still have a free health care system if you're ok with waiting for major ops. In terms of what it would cost me for a GP visit. My current GP costs about $20 a visit but often I can claim the majority back with our Medicare Bulk Billing system (not to be confused with the US Medicare.) Our system seems to work extraordinarily well. Those who want to pay for health care can (like I do, it's not that expensive) ... those who can't afford too are still covered by our free system.

xenophanes 17y ago
One thing you don't mention is the cost of the "free" system. Remember, TANSTAAFL.
- deleted 17y ago
  [deleted]
- froo 17y ago
  Oops, sorry I wrote the comment when I woke up in the middle of the night. Ok, Medicare in Australia is a funded by an income tax levy that every Australian pays, set at 1.5%. It's an almost paltry sum of money when you consider it's free healthcare. My private health insurance also receives a rebate from the Australian Government. From what little I understand about the system, the Australian Government funds this out of my Medicare levy I pay, so that I'm not paying twice. We also have plenty of other medical programs running in Australia - like the Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme which helps low income people afford the medications they require. I'm not up on the numbers, but I think it caps the costs of certain medications at about $5 It works well, I don't know too many people that complain about our system at all. The cost of health care certainly isn't an issue at all that weighs on too many peoples minds
- DennisP 17y ago
  But there is such a thing as a cheap lunch. The U.S. spends a much higher percentage of its GDP for healthcare than any other country, at 17 percent.

jmackinn 17y ago

Could you elaborate on why the UK's and Canada's health care systems suck?

Semiapies 17y ago
Not to snark, but there's a great deal of material on both subjects readily available, and I'm not interested in getting into an argument with a random Canadian or Brit who says eir health care is just awesome. (Hell, my health insurance and health care is pretty awesome, but that can't be generalized to US health care.)
- marshallp 17y ago
  The data says the average brit lives longer and healthier than americans, and the fact that anyone, including temporary visitors can get free healthcare in britain is 'awesome' from the viewpoint of 'humanity' compared to the travesty that is american healthcare.
  - Semiapies 17y ago
    That one sentence has quite a bit wrong and not even wrong about it, and that's before I even get to your implicit demand that I defend the US health care system against your boosterism of the British NHS. This is why I don't argue for or against health care reform.
    - marshallp 17y ago
      There's "material" to support every side of the argument. The only honest data you have are simple measures like life expectancy and costs as percentage of gdp. Universal healthcare clearly trumps any other system in those. Of course the systems aren't perfect, but they're the best of the alternatives.
      - Semiapies 17y ago
        I don't actually have to be here for this argument with you, right? :) Oh, Hell, I'll throw you a bone: what happens to comparative life expectancy numbers when you correct for differing definitions of live birth in the US and the UK? Now, carry on.

maxharris 17y ago

"So, I generally just sit health care debates out, aside from talking side issues with people." So you can't see past the political concretes of today, and you are powerless to influence the future. Some agent for change you are!

Semiapies 17y ago
I'll note that I said nothing of the sort, and I've given you no cause to get personal or misguidedly smug with me.