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Wow thanks, this really makes sense to me. I'm already fluent in Russian, and I am learning my native language, Armenian, at the moment. And I wouldn't say th

by sam191 17y ago

Wow thanks, this really makes sense to me. I'm already fluent in Russian, and I am learning my native language, Armenian, at the moment. And I wouldn't say that I'm under challenged. College seems like a lot of work, but that thrill of a challenge is missing. It's also a tough time for my family, so I'm also working as much as I can. I guess my main dilemma is the lack of free time. It might have been unclear in my post, but I was thinking that my time would be better spent coding than trying to be an overachiever in school. Nevertheless, I really appreciate the advice!

mechanical_fish 17y ago
that thrill of a challenge is missing It still sounds to me like you might not be studying the right stuff. If your classes remind you of a tedious treadmill leading toward the Blub Factory you need better classes. Or a better major. Perhaps you're making the mistake of letting your chosen career dictate your choice of classes. The universal secret to school is: Take the best classes you can find, from the best people, regardless of subject. If the local comp sci offerings remind you of Javaschool, do something else. I have lots and lots of colleagues who can attest that you don't need a major in comp sci, or even a single class, to spend your career working on software. The best bang for the buck in college is the stuff that you can't get anywhere else. Stuff that requires expensive facilities or hardware, for example. Take lab courses -- unlike programming, these are things that are hard to self-study. Biology, physics, chemistry, electronics, mechanical engineering, even art and design (which I suspect is best done with physical materials and a live teacher). Or be a productive dilettante: As I said above, find the best professors in the university and take their courses, regardless of the field. I discovered linguistics that way, and it turns out that intro-level linguistics is a really nice thing to know if you're going to work with languages all the time. If I were to go back I'd probably still take a lot of physics and electronics, which is what I did before, but I'd also be all over the biology and biochemistry. Molecular biology is the ultimate machine language. And I wouldn't neglect statistics: Study as much stats as you can stand. Of course, nontechnical subjects are also important, because they make you write essays. You'd be surprised how useful a skill essay-writing can be. I had a minor in history, and I don't regret it.
- jacoblyles 17y ago
  U Dub has one of the best Comp. Sci. departments in the nation, especially when it comes to Operating Systems. I would sell half my soul to be 18 and going to UW.
  - mechanical_fish 17y ago
    Well, you are you, I am myself, and the OP is the OP. Everyone has different tastes! The good news is that if the OP finds that he doesn't enjoy comp sci, at least he'll know that it isn't because the local department is objectively terrible.
- ytinas 17y ago
  >Or a better major. Perhaps you're making the mistake of letting your chosen career dictate your choice of classes. The universal secret to school is: Take the best classes you can find, from the best people, regardless of subject. I think this is great advice. If I had the opportunity to do college now I would probably try to major in my second (or third!) career choice. Having mobility in where you could have a career could turn out important.
netcan 17y ago
1- College can be good. Patio11 makes some very valuable points and there are plenty of other ways and reasons to make or conclude that it's valuable. 2- Social License - The first paragraph of Patio11s response, subsidy, is incredibly important. For the time and cost of attending college it is possible to take a huge number of alternatives . Buy & run a Jakuzzi installation business, start & run a preschool in a developing country. I have a feeling this is the line of thinking inspiring your question. The problem is that you (and the vast majority of other people) probably won't do that. That's mostly because of this social license. Only an extremely radical parent would give their child a hard earned $100k and 4 years room & board to go buy a Jacuzzi business that will most likely go bust but amount to a tremendous learning opportunity. Everyone would think that they're nuts. Nevermind financial support, you are unlikely to find moral support. Not from society. Not anywhere near the support you receive for bumming through the most meaningless of University degrees. I'm not advocating the easiest option. I actually think there is no excuse not to learn a lot at University. I'm also not advocating going where social norms dictate. Far from it. Just pick you battles and be realistic about opportunity costs. Most of the people who don't do the incredible things that you could be doing instead of College aren't not doing them because they went to college instead.
g1t1t 17y ago
so switch to physics or chemistry or math as an undergrad degree. you won't be left unchallenged, indeed you may find yourself gasping for air trust me, there are college courses out there you couldn't even get a C in to save your life.
krschultz 17y ago
You sound somewhat like me. I coded a huge amount before college. So much so that like you I felt it would be a waste of time to be a CS major. So I took Mechanical Engineering. It is far harder than CS and will certainly give you a challenge. There are complimentary majors (econ, bio, finance, chem E, electrical E, physics, math) you could choose from. Either way you will come out knowing far more math and science that will allow you to do some really cool CS stuff after if thats what you want to do. I minored in CS and so just took some of the more advanced classes, a graduate class on computer graphics, a grad class on computer vision, one on mechatronics, one on Lisp. I don't think I would have been able to learn that stuff as rigorously without a professor. The other courses I would recommend - Operating Systems and Compilers will teach you a LOT. I passed on them but I know people who took them and got a lot out of them. Also about your free time, I know it seems like you are pressed for it right now but college is only 4 years. You wil graduate at 22 and have 43+ years of a career. I work 60-80 hours a week on school stuff and find plenty of time for my own side projects, partying, I was even on a sports team for 3 years. You can do it (you don't sleep much though unlike in the movies where everyone sleeps until 3pm). After graduation I'm going to be working exactly 40, max 50, with a 5 minute commute. Thats it. I'm going to have so much free time to do my side projects that I don't mind missing out on them for the last 4 years when I learned so many other things.

by sam191 17y ago

mechanical_fish 17y ago

that thrill of a challenge is missing It still sounds to me like you might not be studying the right stuff. If your classes remind you of a tedious treadmill leading toward the Blub Factory you need better classes. Or a better major. Perhaps you're making the mistake of letting your chosen career dictate your choice of classes. The universal secret to school is: Take the best classes you can find, from the best people, regardless of subject. If the local comp sci offerings remind you of Javaschool, do something else. I have lots and lots of colleagues who can attest that you don't need a major in comp sci, or even a single class, to spend your career working on software. The best bang for the buck in college is the stuff that you can't get anywhere else. Stuff that requires expensive facilities or hardware, for example. Take lab courses -- unlike programming, these are things that are hard to self-study. Biology, physics, chemistry, electronics, mechanical engineering, even art and design (which I suspect is best done with physical materials and a live teacher). Or be a productive dilettante: As I said above, find the best professors in the university and take their courses, regardless of the field. I discovered linguistics that way, and it turns out that intro-level linguistics is a really nice thing to know if you're going to work with languages all the time. If I were to go back I'd probably still take a lot of physics and electronics, which is what I did before, but I'd also be all over the biology and biochemistry. Molecular biology is the ultimate machine language. And I wouldn't neglect statistics: Study as much stats as you can stand. Of course, nontechnical subjects are also important, because they make you write essays. You'd be surprised how useful a skill essay-writing can be. I had a minor in history, and I don't regret it.

jacoblyles 17y ago
U Dub has one of the best Comp. Sci. departments in the nation, especially when it comes to Operating Systems. I would sell half my soul to be 18 and going to UW.
- mechanical_fish 17y ago
  Well, you are you, I am myself, and the OP is the OP. Everyone has different tastes! The good news is that if the OP finds that he doesn't enjoy comp sci, at least he'll know that it isn't because the local department is objectively terrible.
ytinas 17y ago
>Or a better major. Perhaps you're making the mistake of letting your chosen career dictate your choice of classes. The universal secret to school is: Take the best classes you can find, from the best people, regardless of subject. I think this is great advice. If I had the opportunity to do college now I would probably try to major in my second (or third!) career choice. Having mobility in where you could have a career could turn out important.

netcan 17y ago

1- College can be good. Patio11 makes some very valuable points and there are plenty of other ways and reasons to make or conclude that it's valuable. 2- Social License - The first paragraph of Patio11s response, subsidy, is incredibly important. For the time and cost of attending college it is possible to take a huge number of alternatives . Buy & run a Jakuzzi installation business, start & run a preschool in a developing country. I have a feeling this is the line of thinking inspiring your question. The problem is that you (and the vast majority of other people) probably won't do that. That's mostly because of this social license. Only an extremely radical parent would give their child a hard earned $100k and 4 years room & board to go buy a Jacuzzi business that will most likely go bust but amount to a tremendous learning opportunity. Everyone would think that they're nuts. Nevermind financial support, you are unlikely to find moral support. Not from society. Not anywhere near the support you receive for bumming through the most meaningless of University degrees. I'm not advocating the easiest option. I actually think there is no excuse not to learn a lot at University. I'm also not advocating going where social norms dictate. Far from it. Just pick you battles and be realistic about opportunity costs. Most of the people who don't do the incredible things that you could be doing instead of College aren't not doing them because they went to college instead.

g1t1t 17y ago

so switch to physics or chemistry or math as an undergrad degree. you won't be left unchallenged, indeed you may find yourself gasping for air trust me, there are college courses out there you couldn't even get a C in to save your life.

krschultz 17y ago

You sound somewhat like me. I coded a huge amount before college. So much so that like you I felt it would be a waste of time to be a CS major. So I took Mechanical Engineering. It is far harder than CS and will certainly give you a challenge. There are complimentary majors (econ, bio, finance, chem E, electrical E, physics, math) you could choose from. Either way you will come out knowing far more math and science that will allow you to do some really cool CS stuff after if thats what you want to do. I minored in CS and so just took some of the more advanced classes, a graduate class on computer graphics, a grad class on computer vision, one on mechatronics, one on Lisp. I don't think I would have been able to learn that stuff as rigorously without a professor. The other courses I would recommend - Operating Systems and Compilers will teach you a LOT. I passed on them but I know people who took them and got a lot out of them. Also about your free time, I know it seems like you are pressed for it right now but college is only 4 years. You wil graduate at 22 and have 43+ years of a career. I work 60-80 hours a week on school stuff and find plenty of time for my own side projects, partying, I was even on a sports team for 3 years. You can do it (you don't sleep much though unlike in the movies where everyone sleeps until 3pm). After graduation I'm going to be working exactly 40, max 50, with a 5 minute commute. Thats it. I'm going to have so much free time to do my side projects that I don't mind missing out on them for the last 4 years when I learned so many other things.