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As a web dev for the last 15 years or so, this is amazing news. The browsers are finally getting to a point where the pain jQuery solved, is going away.

k__ 10y ago
Is this a legacy thing? I'm a web dev for 10 years now and never used jQuery directly. (I used Ember for half a year, which seems to have jQuery as dependency)
- jaitsu 10y ago
  If you've been a web dev for 10 years then you'll know that the most fundamental tool for scripting is a pain point (document ready), jQuery did a good job of abstracting the nuances away, see: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/799981/document-ready-equivalent-without-jquery http://stackoverflow.com/questions/799981/document-ready-equ...
  - mattmanser 10y ago
    And the incompatible ajax interfaces. And the inconsistent element selection. And the... I'm also not sure I'd call document ready the most fundamental as a lot of people (including me) used to use onclick='' and onload='' directly on elements back then when we all loaded script tags in the head.
    - k__ 10y ago
      I know these problems, yes. But I didn't hit them, because I mostly did everything on the server side. When I switched to SPAs, I used ExtJS.
  - minitech 10y ago
    Document ready is hardly the most fundamental “tool” for scripting, and it has always been easy to resolve in a cross-browser way: stick your scripts before </body>.
- jcbrand 10y ago
  So did you do JS development back in 2006 without jQuery?
  - brianwawok 10y ago
    I started with Prototype. Not sure if it came out before or after the first jQuery, but it was the cool kid for a while. Then the world realized it was a disaster and started moving to jQuery...
    - k__ 10y ago
      I know a bunch of devs who always preferred Mootools and never did jQuery.
    - DCoder 10y ago
      Too bad Magento devs missed that newsflash. Nowadays it still bundles Prototype.js, and every theme and 50% third-party modules you install carry their own copies of jQuery, all at different versions, placed in random locations, and embedded into the page differently.
  - tacos 10y ago
    I did, then Safari 1.0 happened, and we all went screaming for a solution. Praise jQuery.
  - nilved 10y ago
    Yes
  - k__ 10y ago
    The first few years I did PHP without much client side scripting. Then ExtJS, then a short stint with Ember and after that React.
    - shortstuffsushi 10y ago
      What was your experience with Ext? I had to use it for a few years, and was never a huge fan. We ran into a lot of obscure bugs in their code which resulted in a number of hackaround "Ext.Overrides," and their support forums (Mitch Simmeons in particular) is a joke.
- IE6 10y ago
  I would say no. It's everywhere. Even as you mention it's a common dependency or comes bundled with a lot of stuff. I have not sat down and written logic that "does the same thing in more than one browser" in a very long time but I'd venture to guess the part of jquery that is browser javascript api abstraction is still very relevant today.
  - k__ 10y ago
    Interesting :) To me it always felt kinda strange seeing all these jQuery Stackoverflow questions and answers. When I switched from server side rendering to SPAs, I had the impression everyone was already hating on jQuery and avoided it. I read "Pro JavaScript Techniques" and "JavaScript the good Parts" and started my JS career :) ExtJS 4 came out and I did my first SPA with it. Later I did some university projects with Ember, which seems to use jQuery, but I never had to call one of its functions directly. After that I started freelancing and ended up in a React project, which I found kinda nice to work with.
mhd 10y ago
Which means that in 10 years, that's true for enterprise software, too.
ataylor32 10y ago
jQuery helps with browser quirks, though. Search the below file for the string "// Support" to see what I mean. Yes, there are a lot of entries for older browsers, but there are also a lot of entries for relatively recent browsers too. https://github.com/jquery/jquery/blob/3.0.0-rc1/dist/jquery.js https://github.com/jquery/jquery/blob/3.0.0-rc1/dist/jquery....
- _RPM 10y ago
  Reading the Jquery source code is fun. It seems like they're doing some really clever stuff there. For example, look at isEmptyObject in the code you linked.
  - pvg 10y ago
    What's the particular cleverness in that? It seems it would also fail for objects with non-enumerable properties and properties with ES6 Symbols for names.
- dntrkv 10y ago
  It does help with browser quirks, but if you aren't supporting <IE10, then you really don't need it. I've made it a point to pull out jQuery from every project I have. Nowadays, I can test in Chrome as I develop and then test any other browsers at the very end and I rarely have any browser specific bugs. Crazy how far web dev has come.
  - hamhamed 10y ago
    You do really need it, at least for me. I'd rather write $ sign calls instead of getElementByID or querySelector just to start with. The sizzle library in jQuery is so advanced, that you can't do complex queries on the dom yet with today's browser.
    - leshow 10y ago
      the industry is moving away from direct DOM mutation and towards v-dom, so this isn't an issue for a lot of devs.

k__ 10y ago

Is this a legacy thing? I'm a web dev for 10 years now and never used jQuery directly. (I used Ember for half a year, which seems to have jQuery as dependency)

jaitsu 10y ago
If you've been a web dev for 10 years then you'll know that the most fundamental tool for scripting is a pain point (document ready), jQuery did a good job of abstracting the nuances away, see: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/799981/document-ready-equivalent-without-jquery http://stackoverflow.com/questions/799981/document-ready-equ...
- mattmanser 10y ago
  And the incompatible ajax interfaces. And the inconsistent element selection. And the... I'm also not sure I'd call document ready the most fundamental as a lot of people (including me) used to use onclick='' and onload='' directly on elements back then when we all loaded script tags in the head.
  - k__ 10y ago
    I know these problems, yes. But I didn't hit them, because I mostly did everything on the server side. When I switched to SPAs, I used ExtJS.
- minitech 10y ago
  Document ready is hardly the most fundamental “tool” for scripting, and it has always been easy to resolve in a cross-browser way: stick your scripts before </body>.
jcbrand 10y ago
So did you do JS development back in 2006 without jQuery?
- brianwawok 10y ago
  I started with Prototype. Not sure if it came out before or after the first jQuery, but it was the cool kid for a while. Then the world realized it was a disaster and started moving to jQuery...
  - k__ 10y ago
    I know a bunch of devs who always preferred Mootools and never did jQuery.
  - DCoder 10y ago
    Too bad Magento devs missed that newsflash. Nowadays it still bundles Prototype.js, and every theme and 50% third-party modules you install carry their own copies of jQuery, all at different versions, placed in random locations, and embedded into the page differently.
- tacos 10y ago
  I did, then Safari 1.0 happened, and we all went screaming for a solution. Praise jQuery.
- nilved 10y ago
  Yes
- k__ 10y ago
  The first few years I did PHP without much client side scripting. Then ExtJS, then a short stint with Ember and after that React.
  - shortstuffsushi 10y ago
    What was your experience with Ext? I had to use it for a few years, and was never a huge fan. We ran into a lot of obscure bugs in their code which resulted in a number of hackaround "Ext.Overrides," and their support forums (Mitch Simmeons in particular) is a joke.
IE6 10y ago
I would say no. It's everywhere. Even as you mention it's a common dependency or comes bundled with a lot of stuff. I have not sat down and written logic that "does the same thing in more than one browser" in a very long time but I'd venture to guess the part of jquery that is browser javascript api abstraction is still very relevant today.
- k__ 10y ago
  Interesting :) To me it always felt kinda strange seeing all these jQuery Stackoverflow questions and answers. When I switched from server side rendering to SPAs, I had the impression everyone was already hating on jQuery and avoided it. I read "Pro JavaScript Techniques" and "JavaScript the good Parts" and started my JS career :) ExtJS 4 came out and I did my first SPA with it. Later I did some university projects with Ember, which seems to use jQuery, but I never had to call one of its functions directly. After that I started freelancing and ended up in a React project, which I found kinda nice to work with.

mhd 10y ago

Which means that in 10 years, that's true for enterprise software, too.

ataylor32 10y ago

jQuery helps with browser quirks, though. Search the below file for the string "// Support" to see what I mean. Yes, there are a lot of entries for older browsers, but there are also a lot of entries for relatively recent browsers too. https://github.com/jquery/jquery/blob/3.0.0-rc1/dist/jquery.js https://github.com/jquery/jquery/blob/3.0.0-rc1/dist/jquery....

_RPM 10y ago
Reading the Jquery source code is fun. It seems like they're doing some really clever stuff there. For example, look at isEmptyObject in the code you linked.
- pvg 10y ago
  What's the particular cleverness in that? It seems it would also fail for objects with non-enumerable properties and properties with ES6 Symbols for names.
dntrkv 10y ago
It does help with browser quirks, but if you aren't supporting <IE10, then you really don't need it. I've made it a point to pull out jQuery from every project I have. Nowadays, I can test in Chrome as I develop and then test any other browsers at the very end and I rarely have any browser specific bugs. Crazy how far web dev has come.
- hamhamed 10y ago
  You do really need it, at least for me. I'd rather write $ sign calls instead of getElementByID or querySelector just to start with. The sizzle library in jQuery is so advanced, that you can't do complex queries on the dom yet with today's browser.
  - leshow 10y ago
    the industry is moving away from direct DOM mutation and towards v-dom, so this isn't an issue for a lot of devs.