5 ms·

Bitter Lake [1] connects the Saudi windfall with the rise of global bankers as a power. Showdown at Doha [2] looks into the growing discomfort of US with rise o

Bitter Lake [1] connects the Saudi windfall with the rise of global bankers as a power. Showdown at Doha [2] looks into the growing discomfort of US with rise of Iran and the subsequent strategic deal with SA which has lead us directly to the current mess. The role of the Brits (always busy busy in the shadows) is well worth looking into. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitter_Lake_%28film%29 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitter_Lake_%28film%29 [2]: http://masoudbehnoud.com/weblog/s2.pdf http://masoudbehnoud.com/weblog/s2.pdf

Cyph0n 10y ago
Thanks for the links. I've added Bitter Lake to my watchlist.
- arethuza 10y ago
  FYI Bitter Lake is probably the best thing I've watched in the last couple of years - not sure I completely agree with all of it, but the format and approach is breathtaking.
  - digi_owl 10y ago
    Check out the rest of Curtis' documentaries as well. One eyeopener was part of his Pandora's Box series, A is for Atom, where he looks into the buildup of nuclear reactors on both sides of the cold war. In particular how said reactors, at least in the US, were basically (massively) scaled up submarine reactors.
s_q_b 10y ago
the Brits (always busy busy in the shadows) is well worth looking into. Sigh, the British are constantly furthering their own agenda in the Middle East. Their HUMINT network is just much better than anyone else's in the region, and their active intelligence work is informed by a much more nuanced view of that portion of the world. Americans like to do things from a distance, if they possibly can. Airstrikes, cyberattacks, drones, all involve minimal risk of casualties. The Brits have been on the ground, building their network, for far longer than the Americans. If only they'd share more of the fruits of their labor. It's been a quarter millennium, and British intelligence still looks down their nose at the Americans, treating them like a rebellious problem child.
- arethuza 10y ago
  If anyone thinks the UK doesn't have an agenda in the Middle East separate to that of the US then you might want to consider the Al-Yamamah arms deal: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Yamamah_arms_deal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Yamamah_arms_deal NB - of course the UK does a lot that aligns with US interests, but they aren't identical.
  - s_q_b 10y ago
    Yes, the United States and Great Britain have similar, but not identical interests in the Middle East. Their intelligence operatives are almost preternaturally good (or at least seem that way due to their extremely precise knowledge of the Middle East.) And unlike American intelligence officers, they have a much smaller risk of "going native." American officers are rotated every few years to prevent this effect, while the Brits can keep people in place for decades without the same worry.
    - dkksfj 10y ago
      im not surprised. every (out of 10 or so) brit ive met overseas and had a good chat with out over the last 3 years of being an expat has been a neurotic and/or belligerent asshole whereas most of the americans (out of 20) were able to communicate and assimilate with the local culture. its become such a pattern that i wont even speak english to a person with a british accent anymore. quite a few of them are just looking for physical fights. so strange. and thats the end of my n=30 overseas brits and americans anecdote.
      - pault 10y ago
        My girlfriend runs a hostel and in my experience, the "Rule Britannia" types are a (vocal) minority. No country has a monopoly on jerks...
      - mahyarm 10y ago
        Depends on your expat crowd and reason. The british expats to NYC and SF are usually educated H1B immigrant types and are very pleasant people. The expat who goes to south east asia to retire on their blue collar pension might be a different kind of person.

Cyph0n 10y ago

Thanks for the links. I've added Bitter Lake to my watchlist.

arethuza 10y ago
FYI Bitter Lake is probably the best thing I've watched in the last couple of years - not sure I completely agree with all of it, but the format and approach is breathtaking.
- digi_owl 10y ago
  Check out the rest of Curtis' documentaries as well. One eyeopener was part of his Pandora's Box series, A is for Atom, where he looks into the buildup of nuclear reactors on both sides of the cold war. In particular how said reactors, at least in the US, were basically (massively) scaled up submarine reactors.

s_q_b 10y ago

the Brits (always busy busy in the shadows) is well worth looking into. Sigh, the British are constantly furthering their own agenda in the Middle East. Their HUMINT network is just much better than anyone else's in the region, and their active intelligence work is informed by a much more nuanced view of that portion of the world. Americans like to do things from a distance, if they possibly can. Airstrikes, cyberattacks, drones, all involve minimal risk of casualties. The Brits have been on the ground, building their network, for far longer than the Americans. If only they'd share more of the fruits of their labor. It's been a quarter millennium, and British intelligence still looks down their nose at the Americans, treating them like a rebellious problem child.

arethuza 10y ago
If anyone thinks the UK doesn't have an agenda in the Middle East separate to that of the US then you might want to consider the Al-Yamamah arms deal: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Yamamah_arms_deal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al-Yamamah_arms_deal NB - of course the UK does a lot that aligns with US interests, but they aren't identical.
- s_q_b 10y ago
  Yes, the United States and Great Britain have similar, but not identical interests in the Middle East. Their intelligence operatives are almost preternaturally good (or at least seem that way due to their extremely precise knowledge of the Middle East.) And unlike American intelligence officers, they have a much smaller risk of "going native." American officers are rotated every few years to prevent this effect, while the Brits can keep people in place for decades without the same worry.
  - dkksfj 10y ago
    im not surprised. every (out of 10 or so) brit ive met overseas and had a good chat with out over the last 3 years of being an expat has been a neurotic and/or belligerent asshole whereas most of the americans (out of 20) were able to communicate and assimilate with the local culture. its become such a pattern that i wont even speak english to a person with a british accent anymore. quite a few of them are just looking for physical fights. so strange. and thats the end of my n=30 overseas brits and americans anecdote.
    - pault 10y ago
      My girlfriend runs a hostel and in my experience, the "Rule Britannia" types are a (vocal) minority. No country has a monopoly on jerks...
    - mahyarm 10y ago
      Depends on your expat crowd and reason. The british expats to NYC and SF are usually educated H1B immigrant types and are very pleasant people. The expat who goes to south east asia to retire on their blue collar pension might be a different kind of person.