5 ms·

What's ironic about Thiel attacking Gawker for, supposedly, being bad tabloid journalists is that as a Trump delegate he is supporting someone that has frequent

by guelo 10y ago

What's ironic about Thiel attacking Gawker for, supposedly, being bad tabloid journalists is that as a Trump delegate he is supporting someone that has frequently polluted our highest political discourse with tabloid-level internet conspiracy theories. To Thiel personal smears are more troublesome than a well functioning democracy. But then he has in the past already expressed his contempt of democracy so I guess it should not come as a surprise.

pm24601 10y ago
Thiel's approach is scary. He is basically proving that he doesn't have to win - he just has to consume enough of a media company's money to force them out of business. Many major stories that made it big in the national news start off as a local or small paper doing the initial reporting. (For example the Flint, Mi lead water) These papers have such tiny budgets that they can easily be silenced.
- chimeracoder 10y ago
  > He is basically proving that he doesn't have to win - he just has to consume enough of a media company's money to force them out of business That's theoretically true - after all, it's the same way patent trolling works. But he hasn't actually proven that yet, since he did win a juried verdict (with punitive damages, on top of that). That's about as clear-cut a decision as our legal system can provide (before getting to the appellate level).
  - PlainsWight 10y ago
    To be fair, this is the only one of his suits against Gawker that he's disclosed having funded, so it's quite difficult to judge their overall merits.
- CyberDildonics 10y ago
  Did you read the article? That is how tabloids end up printing false stories about people and defending themselves.
- theoracle101 10y ago
  How is this any different than Gawker using the legal system as a defense strategy? They print whatever they want, and good luck suing them, they'll wear you out in long legal battles with their deep pockets. The only difference this time is they picked on a bully with bigger pockets.
  - internaut 10y ago
    I've seen this question asked about a dozen times now on HN and nobody is even attempting to answer it. It's all handwaving madly so the flaws in their reasoning aren't spotted. That remains my position until a good argument gets presented that isn't all over the place with logic leaps.
- brc 10y ago
  That is the whole point of punitive damages though. The big awards are a punishment of the person or company which lose. Plenty of environmentalists would be happy if an oil company got sued into bankruptcy over a spill. It's the way of the courts, really.
whack 10y ago
I don't get people's need to constantly bring up Thiel's support for Trump, as though it singularly defines him and everything else he does. In this case, his suing Gawker has nothing whatsoever to do with him supporting Trump. Those are 2 completely independent issues, and should be treated as such. Someone could support Trump for a whole bunch of (stupid) reasons that have nothing to do with libel lawsuits, and it's time we stopped conflating these 2 unrelated topics.
- fpgeek 10y ago
  Thiel suing Gawker has is absolutely related to his Trump support. Trump is the presidential candidate who wants to "open up those libel laws" to make it easier to sue the press. It is certainly notable that one of Trump's prominent supports has pushed the boundaries of existing laws in the service of similar goals. In the other direction, Thiel's Trump support suggests that his funding of Gawker lawsuits isn't just about Gawker and his history with them (which is how many people defend Thiel's actions, describing Gawker as an unusually bad actor that is reaping what they sowed). Instead, it suggests that the Gawker lawsuits are indicative of his broader attitudes about how the press should behave and what consequences there should be for press that doesn't.
  - parennoob 10y ago
    > Thiel suing Gawker I think this tends to be papered over too much with "yeah yeah, it's the same thing", but Thiel is not suing Gawker. Thiel is bankrolling a lawsuit against Gawker related to its publishing videos of someone being naked without their consent, an issue that in the case of Erin Andrews led to a $55 million award and widespread public sympathy (http://abcnews.go.com/US/erin-andrews-jury-set-deliberate-75-million-lawsuit/story?id=37460110 http://abcnews.go.com/US/erin-andrews-jury-set-deliberate-75...). Whatever you feel about the Hulk Hogan lawsuit against Gawker is wrong, ask yourself if you would you would feel the same way in the Erin Andrews case.
- cronjobber 10y ago
  It has been hypothesized that our brain's moral systems are a highjack of systems related to hygiene. I think this phenomenon shows it nicely. Since Thiel has "touched" Trump, he is now "unclean" in the minds of people who perceive Trump through their morality circuits.
powertower 10y ago
> Trump ... has frequently polluted our highest political discourse with tabloid-level internet conspiracy theories. If I'm reading your statement correctly... I've listened to some of Trump's speeches, and also the mainstream media's constant misrepresentation of them. Would you mind sharing how Trump is polluting our "highest political discourse"?
- nl 10y ago
  http://www.huffingtonpost.com.au/entry/9-outrageous-things-donald-trump-has-said-about-latinos_us_55e483a1e4b0c818f618904b http://www.huffingtonpost.com.au/entry/9-outrageous-things-d...? http://www.businessinsider.com.au/donald-trump-birther-obama-born-us-2015-7 http://www.businessinsider.com.au/donald-trump-birther-obama... http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/jul/02/donald-trump-racist-claims-mexico-rapes http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/jul/02/donald-trump-... http://edition.cnn.com/2015/09/18/politics/trump-obama-muslim-birther/ http://edition.cnn.com/2015/09/18/politics/trump-obama-musli... http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/gop-primaries/268472-trump-obama-apologized-to-muslims-in-mosque-visit http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/gop-primaries/268472-tru...
- guelo 10y ago
  http://www.businessinsider.com/donald-trump-conspiracy-theories-2016-5?op=1 http://www.businessinsider.com/donald-trump-conspiracy-theor...

by guelo 10y ago

pm24601 10y ago

Thiel's approach is scary. He is basically proving that he doesn't have to win - he just has to consume enough of a media company's money to force them out of business. Many major stories that made it big in the national news start off as a local or small paper doing the initial reporting. (For example the Flint, Mi lead water) These papers have such tiny budgets that they can easily be silenced.

chimeracoder 10y ago
> He is basically proving that he doesn't have to win - he just has to consume enough of a media company's money to force them out of business That's theoretically true - after all, it's the same way patent trolling works. But he hasn't actually proven that yet, since he did win a juried verdict (with punitive damages, on top of that). That's about as clear-cut a decision as our legal system can provide (before getting to the appellate level).
- PlainsWight 10y ago
  To be fair, this is the only one of his suits against Gawker that he's disclosed having funded, so it's quite difficult to judge their overall merits.
CyberDildonics 10y ago
Did you read the article? That is how tabloids end up printing false stories about people and defending themselves.
theoracle101 10y ago
How is this any different than Gawker using the legal system as a defense strategy? They print whatever they want, and good luck suing them, they'll wear you out in long legal battles with their deep pockets. The only difference this time is they picked on a bully with bigger pockets.
- internaut 10y ago
  I've seen this question asked about a dozen times now on HN and nobody is even attempting to answer it. It's all handwaving madly so the flaws in their reasoning aren't spotted. That remains my position until a good argument gets presented that isn't all over the place with logic leaps.
brc 10y ago
That is the whole point of punitive damages though. The big awards are a punishment of the person or company which lose. Plenty of environmentalists would be happy if an oil company got sued into bankruptcy over a spill. It's the way of the courts, really.

whack 10y ago

I don't get people's need to constantly bring up Thiel's support for Trump, as though it singularly defines him and everything else he does. In this case, his suing Gawker has nothing whatsoever to do with him supporting Trump. Those are 2 completely independent issues, and should be treated as such. Someone could support Trump for a whole bunch of (stupid) reasons that have nothing to do with libel lawsuits, and it's time we stopped conflating these 2 unrelated topics.

fpgeek 10y ago
Thiel suing Gawker has is absolutely related to his Trump support. Trump is the presidential candidate who wants to "open up those libel laws" to make it easier to sue the press. It is certainly notable that one of Trump's prominent supports has pushed the boundaries of existing laws in the service of similar goals. In the other direction, Thiel's Trump support suggests that his funding of Gawker lawsuits isn't just about Gawker and his history with them (which is how many people defend Thiel's actions, describing Gawker as an unusually bad actor that is reaping what they sowed). Instead, it suggests that the Gawker lawsuits are indicative of his broader attitudes about how the press should behave and what consequences there should be for press that doesn't.
- parennoob 10y ago
  > Thiel suing Gawker I think this tends to be papered over too much with "yeah yeah, it's the same thing", but Thiel is not suing Gawker. Thiel is bankrolling a lawsuit against Gawker related to its publishing videos of someone being naked without their consent, an issue that in the case of Erin Andrews led to a $55 million award and widespread public sympathy (http://abcnews.go.com/US/erin-andrews-jury-set-deliberate-75-million-lawsuit/story?id=37460110 http://abcnews.go.com/US/erin-andrews-jury-set-deliberate-75...). Whatever you feel about the Hulk Hogan lawsuit against Gawker is wrong, ask yourself if you would you would feel the same way in the Erin Andrews case.
cronjobber 10y ago
It has been hypothesized that our brain's moral systems are a highjack of systems related to hygiene. I think this phenomenon shows it nicely. Since Thiel has "touched" Trump, he is now "unclean" in the minds of people who perceive Trump through their morality circuits.

powertower 10y ago

> Trump ... has frequently polluted our highest political discourse with tabloid-level internet conspiracy theories. If I'm reading your statement correctly... I've listened to some of Trump's speeches, and also the mainstream media's constant misrepresentation of them. Would you mind sharing how Trump is polluting our "highest political discourse"?

nl 10y ago
http://www.huffingtonpost.com.au/entry/9-outrageous-things-donald-trump-has-said-about-latinos_us_55e483a1e4b0c818f618904b http://www.huffingtonpost.com.au/entry/9-outrageous-things-d...? http://www.businessinsider.com.au/donald-trump-birther-obama-born-us-2015-7 http://www.businessinsider.com.au/donald-trump-birther-obama... http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/jul/02/donald-trump-racist-claims-mexico-rapes http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2015/jul/02/donald-trump-... http://edition.cnn.com/2015/09/18/politics/trump-obama-muslim-birther/ http://edition.cnn.com/2015/09/18/politics/trump-obama-musli... http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/gop-primaries/268472-trump-obama-apologized-to-muslims-in-mosque-visit http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/gop-primaries/268472-tru...
guelo 10y ago
http://www.businessinsider.com/donald-trump-conspiracy-theories-2016-5?op=1 http://www.businessinsider.com/donald-trump-conspiracy-theor...