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An interesting thing to note WRT serious applications for exoskeletons is that they arguably offer greater potential as safety devices in the workplaces, essent

An interesting thing to note WRT serious applications for exoskeletons is that they arguably offer greater potential as safety devices in the workplaces, essentially as a means to stop workers from over straining themselves, and also prevent repeated strain injuries. I think realistically, heavy stuff will always be relegated to heavy machines. It'd be impractical in many cases to do otherwise. But to say that exoskeletons lack applications is a bit foolhardy (preventing workplace injury is a huge field waiting to be disrupted, for example). Physical augmentation (via robotics) shouldn't just mean improving the physical condition, but also maintaining and promoting a healthy physical condition. This isn't something that is very well understood in the marketplace (both in the 60's, but also today). The biggest barrier for exoskeletons are still the exoskeletons themselves. I believe that until this idea is understood and reflected in the designs and implementation of exoskeletons, no progress will be made (in the field, and the market). Hopefully, this will soon change. Disclosure: Work in the field (although currently for physically disabled patients, and not announced in the public domain).

rebootthesystem 10y ago
Over the last 9 months I have gained a new perspective on the matter of lifting heavy things. I decided to take weight lifting seriously, hired a coach and went for it. I am now dead-lifting 200 lbs (90 Kg) and squatting the same. If you saw me walking down yhe street you'd have no idea. By the end of the year I should be at 315 for the deadlift. Before doing this I never imagined someone could look "normal" and move this much weight. I thought this was the domain of guys with huge muscles. Anyhow, a long way to say that workplace injury could probably be averted with training.
- ibnroberttuta 10y ago
  I agree with the essence of your argument (and congratulations on the training). I do, however, fear i might've brushed over the essential idea - rather than provide training, wearable's should provide constant 'feedback' if you will to the user, while also providing partial/full assistance to whatever the objective might be. To use an analogy, if you were to draw an imperfect curve, the wearable would 'smooth' out the curve as it was drawn - providing training as a side-effect (muscle-memory, if you will), but that isn't why it would be used (it would be used so you could draw better curves, and maximize your potential as an artist [or in reality, as a worker etc]). I work with exos., so if you have any other questions, I can probably answer them.
- eru 10y ago
  90kg is not that heavy for a squat or deadlift. You need hardly any (visible) muscles for that (unless you are a very small woman). I hope you keep up your progress! There's lots of it left.
  - StavrosK 10y ago
    As someone who got to a 90kg squat (and 100kg deadlift) in three months while still having the skinniest legs possible, I am amazed at how efficient muscles are while being tethered at the very end of a 1 meter lever. I'm pretty sure that our quadriceps could lift a one-ton weight, if attached to it, if only a few cm. That's amazing to me.
    - goldenkey 10y ago
      The concept is as you hint, very much one of continued leverage to prevent reverse movement with constant micro gains in forward distance. https://youtu.be/0kFmbrRJq4w https://youtu.be/0kFmbrRJq4w Very much a parallel process with the same kind of force multiplication as any gear ratio mechanical advantage. Quite marvelous what the simple ability to "stick" can be translated into. Tremendous static holds equals tremendous kinetic force :-)
  - rebootthesystem 10y ago
    Well, let me disagree. Lifting 90 Kg for someone with probably a decade of a lack of serious exercise due to sitting in front of the computer for 16 hours a day building a couple of businesses is a LOT. I used to swim and do martial arts. I got to a point where I couldn't recognize myself because of how out of shape I got. Not grossly overweight but just weak and with a serious lack of mobility. Weight in the vicinity of 100 Kg, is dangerous to put on your shoulders or lift off the ground. It could put you in the hospital. Age is a factor, of course, I'm over 50. Yet, even for younger people, it's a dangerous amount of weight. I purposely took it very easy. I devoted four months to very slow and careful general strength (machines), flexibility and mobility exercises. Also added cardio. The idea was to get a little injury-proof before starting down the path of more serious lifting. Having said that, now that I am on a roll I see making significant gains over the months ahead. Carefully and safely.
ansgri 10y ago
Is your startup similar to ExoAtlet? http://www.exoatlet.com http://www.exoatlet.com Some dozens of them are currently being tested in Russian hospitals.
- ibnroberttuta 10y ago
  Not quite - the technology and approach taken are essentially very new developments in the field, in general to avoid pitfalls of current/past state of the art. Since exoskeletons should be useful to humans, they should probably be designed like humans, and move like them too. This is our philosophy, and for this and many other reasons, the approach we've taken is distinctly different and very new. Our objective is to give users uncompromising levels of mobility. We hope to begin private trials within the next 1.5-2 years.
gene-h 10y ago
I agree with you. I'm not trying to say that exoskeletons lack applications, just that the whole 'power-loader' concept is a bit silly. GE wanted the user of the hardiman to be able to pick up a 1.5 ton load and walk around with it. There aren't that many applications that require a 1.5 ton load to be 'walked around.' And yes, the orthotics market for exoskeletons is very big, and largely ignored, one.

rebootthesystem 10y ago

Over the last 9 months I have gained a new perspective on the matter of lifting heavy things. I decided to take weight lifting seriously, hired a coach and went for it. I am now dead-lifting 200 lbs (90 Kg) and squatting the same. If you saw me walking down yhe street you'd have no idea. By the end of the year I should be at 315 for the deadlift. Before doing this I never imagined someone could look "normal" and move this much weight. I thought this was the domain of guys with huge muscles. Anyhow, a long way to say that workplace injury could probably be averted with training.

ibnroberttuta 10y ago
I agree with the essence of your argument (and congratulations on the training). I do, however, fear i might've brushed over the essential idea - rather than provide training, wearable's should provide constant 'feedback' if you will to the user, while also providing partial/full assistance to whatever the objective might be. To use an analogy, if you were to draw an imperfect curve, the wearable would 'smooth' out the curve as it was drawn - providing training as a side-effect (muscle-memory, if you will), but that isn't why it would be used (it would be used so you could draw better curves, and maximize your potential as an artist [or in reality, as a worker etc]). I work with exos., so if you have any other questions, I can probably answer them.
eru 10y ago
90kg is not that heavy for a squat or deadlift. You need hardly any (visible) muscles for that (unless you are a very small woman). I hope you keep up your progress! There's lots of it left.
- StavrosK 10y ago
  As someone who got to a 90kg squat (and 100kg deadlift) in three months while still having the skinniest legs possible, I am amazed at how efficient muscles are while being tethered at the very end of a 1 meter lever. I'm pretty sure that our quadriceps could lift a one-ton weight, if attached to it, if only a few cm. That's amazing to me.
  - goldenkey 10y ago
    The concept is as you hint, very much one of continued leverage to prevent reverse movement with constant micro gains in forward distance. https://youtu.be/0kFmbrRJq4w https://youtu.be/0kFmbrRJq4w Very much a parallel process with the same kind of force multiplication as any gear ratio mechanical advantage. Quite marvelous what the simple ability to "stick" can be translated into. Tremendous static holds equals tremendous kinetic force :-)
- rebootthesystem 10y ago
  Well, let me disagree. Lifting 90 Kg for someone with probably a decade of a lack of serious exercise due to sitting in front of the computer for 16 hours a day building a couple of businesses is a LOT. I used to swim and do martial arts. I got to a point where I couldn't recognize myself because of how out of shape I got. Not grossly overweight but just weak and with a serious lack of mobility. Weight in the vicinity of 100 Kg, is dangerous to put on your shoulders or lift off the ground. It could put you in the hospital. Age is a factor, of course, I'm over 50. Yet, even for younger people, it's a dangerous amount of weight. I purposely took it very easy. I devoted four months to very slow and careful general strength (machines), flexibility and mobility exercises. Also added cardio. The idea was to get a little injury-proof before starting down the path of more serious lifting. Having said that, now that I am on a roll I see making significant gains over the months ahead. Carefully and safely.

ansgri 10y ago

Is your startup similar to ExoAtlet? http://www.exoatlet.com http://www.exoatlet.com Some dozens of them are currently being tested in Russian hospitals.

ibnroberttuta 10y ago
Not quite - the technology and approach taken are essentially very new developments in the field, in general to avoid pitfalls of current/past state of the art. Since exoskeletons should be useful to humans, they should probably be designed like humans, and move like them too. This is our philosophy, and for this and many other reasons, the approach we've taken is distinctly different and very new. Our objective is to give users uncompromising levels of mobility. We hope to begin private trials within the next 1.5-2 years.

gene-h 10y ago

I agree with you. I'm not trying to say that exoskeletons lack applications, just that the whole 'power-loader' concept is a bit silly. GE wanted the user of the hardiman to be able to pick up a 1.5 ton load and walk around with it. There aren't that many applications that require a 1.5 ton load to be 'walked around.' And yes, the orthotics market for exoskeletons is very big, and largely ignored, one.