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Hardly thousands. 240 000 people die every year in car accidents and no one prohibits cars. Millions died in WW2, but it is not the USSR to blame for it. How m

Hardly thousands. 240 000 people die every year in car accidents and no one prohibits cars. Millions died in WW2, but it is not the USSR to blame for it. How many Indians were killed for the US to prosper? We are speaking about fhe better system you never tried. No rich, no poor, everyone has a job.

snowwindwaves 10y ago
>Everyone has a job I visited cuba in 1998 for a few weeks. I was staying with a family who hosted visitors like my father and myself for a little extra foreign currency on the side. The father of the family that we were staying with was a chief economist in Castro's government. I will never forget riding the elevator at the university in Havana. There was a woman whose job it was to press the buttons in the elevator after you told her what floor you wanted to go to. She was there every day. I can't imagine that was a very fulfilling job for her, as there was clearly no point as people could just press the buttons themselves. Jobs still need to be productive on some level
- ommunist 10y ago
  You are surprisingly right. Small state like Cuba with monocultural agriculture and lack of industry is destined for that. But even in these hard conditions Cuba has a better and more people oriented medical care system than the US has and is exporting medical know-how to the third world.
sbuttgereit 10y ago
Hardly thousands That is a barefaced lie. Forgetting the rest of the evil attributable to Communist ideology, the Ukrainian Genocide alone is evidence that it was many more than "hardly thousands": http://www.ncas.rutgers.edu/center-study-genocide-conflict-resolution-and-human-rights/ukrainian-famine http://www.ncas.rutgers.edu/center-study-genocide-conflict-r... Indeed, one need only consider the ease of which one could immigrate out of USSR, or other Communist states for that matter, to know something was seriously fucked in your glorious worker's paradise. How good can a political system possibly be when that same system makes it illegal to leave the country and your own citizens are willing to risk their lives to get out? I think if you look back on history, the real stand-out achievements of the Communist system are really it's unrivaled ability to systematically dole out want, suffering, and death to all but a political elite. Given the logic of your last arguments however, I can easily see why someone such as yourself can look past the facts of the matter and support such a murderous, despicable system such as Communism. Pointing to accidental deaths, or deaths from wars, or other misdeeds as somehow justifying the volitional and indiscriminate murder of whole populations defies logic. Someone else's wrong does not justify the sort of violence that your original posting obliquely supported. In the end, your willingness to claim the great benefits of Communism while evading the methods used to cement the power of Communist party officials over the population should be red flag enough to any sane-minded person to reject you and your wares. Even then I would argue the equality of misery produced by the Communist to be no great achievement. Oh... and as for never trying it... I've never been burnt to death either, but I'm smart enough to know I want no part of it.
- ommunist 10y ago
  This was not equality of misery. It was equality of opportunities. My father was a factory worker, my mother was from peasants family. They were able to put me into high class secondary school and I was in position to select any university after graduating from it. In the modern UK this is financially impossible for a family like that to give that kind of education to their kids. Besides, there was no such thing as 'Ukrainian genocide', its a part of modern US political discourse to maintain the US political agenda in the Eastern Europe, hence the research you are referring to.
  - notahacker 10y ago
    In 1989 about 8% of the population of the Soviet Union had been through tertiary education. The modern UK sends nearly half its young adults to university, including an awful lot of people whose parents are manual labourers (we don't, admittedly, have any peasants)
- aoeusnth1 10y ago
  In reply to ommonuist's claim that there is "no such thing as the Ukrainian genocide", see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor. There's clearly some doublethink going on trying to justify the mass murder of the system he wants to impose on the West.
  - ommunist 10y ago
    You know, in 20 years Wikipedia will tell it was only the US who fought Germany in WW2 and someone on HN equivalent will point to that article as a proof of his knowledge. History is not without the sense of irony.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
nazgob 10y ago
Why its not USSR to blame? USSR allied with Nazi Germany and attacked many free nations. Finland, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Poland. Everywhere leaving destruction, death and misery. War war followed with bloody enforcement of communism in occupied nations.
- ommunist 10y ago
  Sorry to disappoint you, but Latvia, Estonia and Lithuania happily united with USSR the way Austria was united with Germany. And since my father was born in exact place and time you are referring to, I can make you sure that my family archive contains enough proof of the view that is quite contrary to your rhetorical exercise. In just 10 years after WW2 ended, Latvia for example, became from being allotments of Britain and Sweden a modern industrial country. And now this time is called in Latvian school history books 'the period of unnecessary development'.
  - nazgob 10y ago
    Soviet apologist on HN, I regret answering to you. Bye.

snowwindwaves 10y ago

>Everyone has a job I visited cuba in 1998 for a few weeks. I was staying with a family who hosted visitors like my father and myself for a little extra foreign currency on the side. The father of the family that we were staying with was a chief economist in Castro's government. I will never forget riding the elevator at the university in Havana. There was a woman whose job it was to press the buttons in the elevator after you told her what floor you wanted to go to. She was there every day. I can't imagine that was a very fulfilling job for her, as there was clearly no point as people could just press the buttons themselves. Jobs still need to be productive on some level

ommunist 10y ago
You are surprisingly right. Small state like Cuba with monocultural agriculture and lack of industry is destined for that. But even in these hard conditions Cuba has a better and more people oriented medical care system than the US has and is exporting medical know-how to the third world.

sbuttgereit 10y ago

Hardly thousands That is a barefaced lie. Forgetting the rest of the evil attributable to Communist ideology, the Ukrainian Genocide alone is evidence that it was many more than "hardly thousands": http://www.ncas.rutgers.edu/center-study-genocide-conflict-resolution-and-human-rights/ukrainian-famine http://www.ncas.rutgers.edu/center-study-genocide-conflict-r... Indeed, one need only consider the ease of which one could immigrate out of USSR, or other Communist states for that matter, to know something was seriously fucked in your glorious worker's paradise. How good can a political system possibly be when that same system makes it illegal to leave the country and your own citizens are willing to risk their lives to get out? I think if you look back on history, the real stand-out achievements of the Communist system are really it's unrivaled ability to systematically dole out want, suffering, and death to all but a political elite. Given the logic of your last arguments however, I can easily see why someone such as yourself can look past the facts of the matter and support such a murderous, despicable system such as Communism. Pointing to accidental deaths, or deaths from wars, or other misdeeds as somehow justifying the volitional and indiscriminate murder of whole populations defies logic. Someone else's wrong does not justify the sort of violence that your original posting obliquely supported. In the end, your willingness to claim the great benefits of Communism while evading the methods used to cement the power of Communist party officials over the population should be red flag enough to any sane-minded person to reject you and your wares. Even then I would argue the equality of misery produced by the Communist to be no great achievement. Oh... and as for never trying it... I've never been burnt to death either, but I'm smart enough to know I want no part of it.

ommunist 10y ago
This was not equality of misery. It was equality of opportunities. My father was a factory worker, my mother was from peasants family. They were able to put me into high class secondary school and I was in position to select any university after graduating from it. In the modern UK this is financially impossible for a family like that to give that kind of education to their kids. Besides, there was no such thing as 'Ukrainian genocide', its a part of modern US political discourse to maintain the US political agenda in the Eastern Europe, hence the research you are referring to.
- notahacker 10y ago
  In 1989 about 8% of the population of the Soviet Union had been through tertiary education. The modern UK sends nearly half its young adults to university, including an awful lot of people whose parents are manual labourers (we don't, admittedly, have any peasants)
aoeusnth1 10y ago
In reply to ommonuist's claim that there is "no such thing as the Ukrainian genocide", see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor. There's clearly some doublethink going on trying to justify the mass murder of the system he wants to impose on the West.
- ommunist 10y ago
  You know, in 20 years Wikipedia will tell it was only the US who fought Germany in WW2 and someone on HN equivalent will point to that article as a proof of his knowledge. History is not without the sense of irony.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]

nazgob 10y ago

Why its not USSR to blame? USSR allied with Nazi Germany and attacked many free nations. Finland, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Poland. Everywhere leaving destruction, death and misery. War war followed with bloody enforcement of communism in occupied nations.

ommunist 10y ago
Sorry to disappoint you, but Latvia, Estonia and Lithuania happily united with USSR the way Austria was united with Germany. And since my father was born in exact place and time you are referring to, I can make you sure that my family archive contains enough proof of the view that is quite contrary to your rhetorical exercise. In just 10 years after WW2 ended, Latvia for example, became from being allotments of Britain and Sweden a modern industrial country. And now this time is called in Latvian school history books 'the period of unnecessary development'.
- nazgob 10y ago
  Soviet apologist on HN, I regret answering to you. Bye.