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I know that this article is talking just about subways, but they brought up the issue of infrastructure spending being far too low. In many cases, however, it's

I know that this article is talking just about subways, but they brought up the issue of infrastructure spending being far too low. In many cases, however, it's more about the spending being incredibly poorly directed. I was talking to someone who used to sit on the commission of a Virginia city. He told me that VDOT pays for 95% of road construction and maintenance if it conforms to VDOT urban code. This is incredibly foolish for two reasons: 1. Urban code requires a minimum 28 foot road width. Understanding that "urban" here best means "where there might be some people" rather than significant density, this is a horrendous plan because it encourages huge roads designed for ~45mph. these roads optimize traffic throughput in places that should be optimized for livability, resulting in unnecessarily high spending and, more importantly, dangerous car-paths that discourage crossing the street, or even using it at all without a car. 2. More relevant to infrastructure spending, this imbalanced gravy train means that a town can easily add the tax base of large retailers at the edges of town, and the only cost to them is 5% of the huge roads involved in getting people out to those relatively unproductive stores. The result is a land-use problem where people have no inclination to build near one another, and the resulting dysfunctional road system that tries to move people and foster economic activity with the same infrastructure, and does both quite poorly. It's the futon of roads. And sure it's nice (if you live in one of these places) to be able to drive to the huge grocery store and pick from 8 different kinds of mustard, but if you're buying the specialty versions, you should probably just be ordering it online. Granted, that's just the Virginia system, but it seems reasonable to expect that it would be similar in other states. In my travels, I haven't noticed many (U.S.) places that didn't fall into similar patterns.

rayiner 10y ago
> And sure it's nice (if you live in one of these places) to be able to drive to the huge grocery store and pick from 8 different kinds of mustard It's not. It's a disaster. It takes you 30 minutes just to grab some toothpaste if you run out. The NOVA suburbs are utterly dysfunctional and traffic is near a breaking point. It's often faster to drive to DC from Annapolis than from Great Falls or Reston (despite the latter being half the distance).
- yompers888 10y ago
  There's a name for this sort of misunderstanding on the internet, but it escapes me. To be clear, what I meant is "All other factors ignored, it can be mildly convenient to have access to this abundance of choice." Although, I actually hate having this much choice, as it makes it impossible to shop in a grocery store you don't know, and while I'm at it, I love the size of Trader Joe's parking lots. I was trying to address one (of many, many) complaints that people bring when you suggest something taming the infrastructure demon. Also frequently heard: "If you shrink the lane width and slow the roads down to 25, it'll take forever to get across town!" First of all, if you stop building dumb stroads (street-road hybrids, the aforementioned futon of traffic engineering), the towns will be much smaller, so you'll only have to go half the distance. Hell, you might even be able walk or ride your bike! I feel for you if you're living and commuting around DC. I did a month-long internship that had me commuting between Fort Meade and Annapolis, and it made me swear off commuting by car. I also spent years making frequent trips between Annapolis and Charlottesville, so I got to watch the expansion down the 95 corridor. You haven't experienced the madness of crowds until you've seen people buying expensive homes as far South as Stafford so that they can spend the next decade hating themselves as they spend 10% of their existence hating themselves as they idle on 95. The DC beltway is the epitome of poor land use.
- snowwrestler 10y ago
  Of course it's faster to drive to DC from Annapolis; Maryland does not have a river between it and DC. There are dozens of streets that connect...it's essentially a continuous urban zone across the border. To drive from VA to DC, you have your choice of 5 bridges with an aggregate total of about 15 lanes to carry all the traffic. It doesn't take much volume to back things up.
burfog 10y ago
It is not very livable or safe when roads are narrow. I've lived on that kind of street. There was little margin for kids running out of control. In the blink of an eye, they'd be in the road. (actually happened on my street) Parked cars would constrict the road, and then the snowplows would pile snow against the cars. There was no safety margin for a car that starts to slide on ice. I was at least lucky that the street was short and didn't really go anywhere interesting. Had that not been the case, there would've been a very slow exhaust-emitting line of cars creeping down the middle. My lungs really don't need that.

rayiner 10y ago

> And sure it's nice (if you live in one of these places) to be able to drive to the huge grocery store and pick from 8 different kinds of mustard It's not. It's a disaster. It takes you 30 minutes just to grab some toothpaste if you run out. The NOVA suburbs are utterly dysfunctional and traffic is near a breaking point. It's often faster to drive to DC from Annapolis than from Great Falls or Reston (despite the latter being half the distance).

yompers888 10y ago
There's a name for this sort of misunderstanding on the internet, but it escapes me. To be clear, what I meant is "All other factors ignored, it can be mildly convenient to have access to this abundance of choice." Although, I actually hate having this much choice, as it makes it impossible to shop in a grocery store you don't know, and while I'm at it, I love the size of Trader Joe's parking lots. I was trying to address one (of many, many) complaints that people bring when you suggest something taming the infrastructure demon. Also frequently heard: "If you shrink the lane width and slow the roads down to 25, it'll take forever to get across town!" First of all, if you stop building dumb stroads (street-road hybrids, the aforementioned futon of traffic engineering), the towns will be much smaller, so you'll only have to go half the distance. Hell, you might even be able walk or ride your bike! I feel for you if you're living and commuting around DC. I did a month-long internship that had me commuting between Fort Meade and Annapolis, and it made me swear off commuting by car. I also spent years making frequent trips between Annapolis and Charlottesville, so I got to watch the expansion down the 95 corridor. You haven't experienced the madness of crowds until you've seen people buying expensive homes as far South as Stafford so that they can spend the next decade hating themselves as they spend 10% of their existence hating themselves as they idle on 95. The DC beltway is the epitome of poor land use.
snowwrestler 10y ago
Of course it's faster to drive to DC from Annapolis; Maryland does not have a river between it and DC. There are dozens of streets that connect...it's essentially a continuous urban zone across the border. To drive from VA to DC, you have your choice of 5 bridges with an aggregate total of about 15 lanes to carry all the traffic. It doesn't take much volume to back things up.

burfog 10y ago

It is not very livable or safe when roads are narrow. I've lived on that kind of street. There was little margin for kids running out of control. In the blink of an eye, they'd be in the road. (actually happened on my street) Parked cars would constrict the road, and then the snowplows would pile snow against the cars. There was no safety margin for a car that starts to slide on ice. I was at least lucky that the street was short and didn't really go anywhere interesting. Had that not been the case, there would've been a very slow exhaust-emitting line of cars creeping down the middle. My lungs really don't need that.