7 ms·

4 bit computer built from discrete transistors

91 points by danielam 10y ago

bashinator 10y ago
I always like to point out the telegraph relay computer[0] built by one Harry Porter. I think that pretty much takes the cake for retro hardware. It also brings up the question of how early a binary computer could have been built, since the relay was invented in the early/mid 1800s[1] and Boolean logic in 1847[2] [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3wPBcmSb2U https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3wPBcmSb2U [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relay#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relay#History [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Boole#Symbolic_logic https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Boole#Symbolic_logic
- asimuvPR 10y ago
  Makes you wonder what will be built in the next hundred years with what we have available now.
  - hola_hola 10y ago
    Strong AI. We probably have the technology to build it now but not the know-how.
    - intrasight 10y ago
      I'd be happy with Weak AI
  - pjmlp 10y ago
    I would be happy with the Xerox PARC developer experience becoming mainstream, instead of people insisting in replaying a PDP-11 developer experience on their hexacore workstation with 16 GB and 2 GB GPGPU and the insistence of relying on programming languages that were already known as unsafe in early 70's for our IT infrastructure.
    - nickpsecurity 10y ago
      It's a nice thought but not happening. Given transition to hardware accelerators, I'd also be happy with products like this coming down to consumer, mid-range price: http://picocomputing.com/products/picocube/picomini/ http://picocomputing.com/products/picocube/picomini/ Imagine what I could do with that baby armed with HLS or Qflow. :)
- TheOtherHobbes 10y ago
  For some reason it took 90 years for Boolean switched hardware to appear - originally invented by Shannon in the US and Zuse in Germany in the late 1930s. It's interesting to wonder why it took so long, and what would have happened if it had been invented much earlier. The first may have been because Boolean algebra was very obscure and unlikely to cross the path of the electromechanical and telegraph engineers who worked with relays. The second I can't even begin to speculate about - although the first FET was patented in 1925, so in theory it would have been possible to build a solid state computer not long after.
  - wycx 10y ago
    The idea of the transistor was patented in 1926, but it took all the hard work of making a transistor by the Bell Labs team for discrete transistors to become a reality. See [1] for an excellent summary of the birth of the transistor. [1] http://www.amazon.com/Crystal-Fire-Transistor-Information-Technology/dp/0393318516 http://www.amazon.com/Crystal-Fire-Transistor-Information-Te...
    - jrapdx3 10y ago
      The book you reference is no doubt a lot more thorough, but the wikipedia article is a pretty good brief overview: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_transistor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_transistor
  - jrapdx3 10y ago
    The story of the FET is interesting. Patented in 1925 and 1928 by Lilienfeld, the invention wasn't implemented until the 1940's. Researchers at Bell Labs, Shockley and Pearson, build operational devices based on Lilienfeld's work, but never acknowledged the Lilienfeld FET in their published reports. FET production began in the 1950's when supporting technologies became available. Later on in the 1990's the original FET designs were implemented and produced working devices. Surprising how old many technologies really are. As with the FET it can take a long time before inventions or discoveries can be realized and put to good use.
MarcScott 10y ago
I went to see this 16 bit processor a few months ago. It's stunning to see. http://www.megaprocessor.com/index.html http://www.megaprocessor.com/index.html
tdeck 10y ago
If you like this, you might appreciate the very retro homebrew CPU webring: http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/ringhome.html http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/ringhome.html
- bashinator 10y ago
  Yep, that's the ring Harry Porter is on.
kuschku 10y ago
I’d like to point out that this is common at many universities for compsci undergrad students as 2nd-year project (although usually done simulated in Xilinx ISE and ISim). It’s definitely interesting to do these things (I’m currently taking abovementioned course at my uni, designing first a 4-bit harvard architecture processor in Xilinx, and, after that’s done, in 2 weeks starting with designing a DLX in Xilinx), but it’s even more amazing to see someone actually build these things IRL (and thereby prove that these are actually useful skills to have!)
toomanythings2 10y ago
I used to design and build whole systems from TTL logic in the 70s and 80s. The most integrated part was the ALU from AMD, otherwise, it was mostly NAND and NOR gates. Great fun, especially cause we knew how everything worked.
userbinator 10y ago
Just recently there was another project building processors with discretes, a 6502: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11703596 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11703596

91 points by danielam 10y ago

I always like to point out the telegraph relay computer[0] built by one Harry Porter. I think that pretty much takes the cake for retro hardware. It also brings up the question of how early a binary computer could have been built, since the relay was invented in the early/mid 1800s[1] and Boolean logic in 1847[2] [0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3wPBcmSb2U https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3wPBcmSb2U [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relay#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relay#History [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Boole#Symbolic_logic https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Boole#Symbolic_logic

asimuvPR 10y ago
Makes you wonder what will be built in the next hundred years with what we have available now.
- hola_hola 10y ago
  Strong AI. We probably have the technology to build it now but not the know-how.
  - intrasight 10y ago
    I'd be happy with Weak AI
- pjmlp 10y ago
  I would be happy with the Xerox PARC developer experience becoming mainstream, instead of people insisting in replaying a PDP-11 developer experience on their hexacore workstation with 16 GB and 2 GB GPGPU and the insistence of relying on programming languages that were already known as unsafe in early 70's for our IT infrastructure.
  - nickpsecurity 10y ago
    It's a nice thought but not happening. Given transition to hardware accelerators, I'd also be happy with products like this coming down to consumer, mid-range price: http://picocomputing.com/products/picocube/picomini/ http://picocomputing.com/products/picocube/picomini/ Imagine what I could do with that baby armed with HLS or Qflow. :)
TheOtherHobbes 10y ago
For some reason it took 90 years for Boolean switched hardware to appear - originally invented by Shannon in the US and Zuse in Germany in the late 1930s. It's interesting to wonder why it took so long, and what would have happened if it had been invented much earlier. The first may have been because Boolean algebra was very obscure and unlikely to cross the path of the electromechanical and telegraph engineers who worked with relays. The second I can't even begin to speculate about - although the first FET was patented in 1925, so in theory it would have been possible to build a solid state computer not long after.
- wycx 10y ago
  The idea of the transistor was patented in 1926, but it took all the hard work of making a transistor by the Bell Labs team for discrete transistors to become a reality. See [1] for an excellent summary of the birth of the transistor. [1] http://www.amazon.com/Crystal-Fire-Transistor-Information-Technology/dp/0393318516 http://www.amazon.com/Crystal-Fire-Transistor-Information-Te...
  - jrapdx3 10y ago
    The book you reference is no doubt a lot more thorough, but the wikipedia article is a pretty good brief overview: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_transistor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_transistor
- jrapdx3 10y ago
  The story of the FET is interesting. Patented in 1925 and 1928 by Lilienfeld, the invention wasn't implemented until the 1940's. Researchers at Bell Labs, Shockley and Pearson, build operational devices based on Lilienfeld's work, but never acknowledged the Lilienfeld FET in their published reports. FET production began in the 1950's when supporting technologies became available. Later on in the 1990's the original FET designs were implemented and produced working devices. Surprising how old many technologies really are. As with the FET it can take a long time before inventions or discoveries can be realized and put to good use.

MarcScott 10y ago

I went to see this 16 bit processor a few months ago. It's stunning to see. http://www.megaprocessor.com/index.html http://www.megaprocessor.com/index.html

tdeck 10y ago

If you like this, you might appreciate the very retro homebrew CPU webring: http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/ringhome.html http://members.iinet.net.au/~daveb/simplex/ringhome.html

bashinator 10y ago
Yep, that's the ring Harry Porter is on.

kuschku 10y ago

I’d like to point out that this is common at many universities for compsci undergrad students as 2nd-year project (although usually done simulated in Xilinx ISE and ISim). It’s definitely interesting to do these things (I’m currently taking abovementioned course at my uni, designing first a 4-bit harvard architecture processor in Xilinx, and, after that’s done, in 2 weeks starting with designing a DLX in Xilinx), but it’s even more amazing to see someone actually build these things IRL (and thereby prove that these are actually useful skills to have!)

toomanythings2 10y ago

I used to design and build whole systems from TTL logic in the 70s and 80s. The most integrated part was the ALU from AMD, otherwise, it was mostly NAND and NOR gates. Great fun, especially cause we knew how everything worked.

userbinator 10y ago

Just recently there was another project building processors with discretes, a 6502: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11703596 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11703596