10 ms·

Jolla C, a new Sailfish OS phone from Jolla

145 points by anttiviljami 10y ago

andridk 10y ago
I have a Jolla phone, and used it exclusively until it met with the sidewalk and cracked the screen. The OS is a breeze to use, even if you're using Android apps. However after the whole Jolla Tablet fiasco, I am reluctant to buy more from the company.
bruce_one 10y ago
Very surprised, I hadn't anticipated this happening. (Irrationally excited too.) I'd assumed that after the tablet fiasco that Jolla wouldn't be doing any hardware for a long time. (I'm not personally grumpy in any way, but I think fiasco is the most accurate word :-s ) I'd been holding out hope for an official Fairphone 2 deal (or even the Puzzlephone), but this is awesome :-)
- chappi42 10y ago
  It's a 'super-pity' that the tablet failed. I have one and like it a lot! (<3 to jolla for trying to provide a more open and friendly ecosystem, wish you were a billion-euro-strong company)
- walkingolof 10y ago
  I assume that the investment in the hardware is very limited, likely a OEM phone with branding. Smart move for a developer phone.
tychuz 10y ago
Well, it's even less popular than Windows Phone - that's quite an achievement!
- b34r 10y ago
  Or Tizen, lol.
- pekk 10y ago
  Microsoft dumped a lot of money into making Windows Phone succeed. Jolla has the opposite problem and has not even tried to enter the US market.
- RaleyField 10y ago
  Windows Phone got some traction for being both Windows and because it was made by Nokia, in comparison Jolla doesn't distinguish itself that much.
mullsork 10y ago
Any Jolla/Sailfish users out there that could shed some light on their impressions so far? I'm reluctant to switch to Android or iOS but I will need to switch out my phone real soon.
- shmerl 10y ago
  I'm using it for everyday purposes on Nexus 5. UI usability is excellent. My only problem - the browser development is stalled and it's using outdated Gecko fork.
- gulpahum 10y ago
  It has a bit unusual user interface. They designed it to be usable by one hand, but I think they just ended up with a bit messy UI. It takes some time to get used to and some features are not easy to discover (like the top sliding menu or the context menu on list items). It runs its own native Sailfish apps (there's few hundred of them) and Android apps (you can install Google Play, if you follow a bit cumbersome instructions). However, the UI logic in native apps is different than in Android apps. Native apps use a lot of wiping gestures, while Android apps use more tapping and the back button. There is also a native web browser (built on top of Gecko) and it has its own UI logic (the usual web browser logic with a back button, no gestures). So, all together, it has three way to navigate, which makes the whole experience a bit fragmented. But, if you want to escape the surveillance riddled Android and iPhone, Jolla is a good basic phone. It offers a lot for hackers, because its built on top of Linux and you have access to almost everything without rooting. I got my phone three years ago and I'm still getting OS updates regularly, which is also nice. I just wish the UI was better.
  - mullsork 10y ago
    Thanks for the writeup. I wouldn't mind having a very hackable phone I suppose. Does one need Linux to enjoy it at its fullest, or is OSX also okay?
    - deleted 10y ago
      [deleted]
sametmax 10y ago
I was using a dumb phone and a change of life made me need a smartphone. A friend of mine encouraged me to get a Jolla. I liked the idea, Open Source, you can code your app in Python, compatible with Android apps, etc. At the begining, I was very tolerant with the quirks of the phone, being a FOSS believer and all. But after months and months of use, I'm getting more and more frustrated with it: - it's slow. - apps randomly crashes or don't start at all. - Android support is limited. - network is unreliable. - the performances don't allow any decent Web surf experience, and I already hate the Web on mobile so it makes things irritating for me. - it requires a lot of fiddling to adapt it to your needs. It can be good if you need customization, but some basic stuff (such as emoji) are not included by default. Some might consider that a feature, but when a girl text me a smiley when I flirt with her, I want to know what face it has because it kinda condition my next answer. - some bugs are incredibly annoying. The worst being the poor handling of group text messages which lead to very confusing conversations. A smartphone that can't text, really? - ergonomy is lacking at best. While I think there are some neat ideas, the hidden menu for simple tasks, the absence of resize in some picture mode and the presence of it in others and plenty other subtle details make it cumbersome to use even for basic stuff. The color scheme and overall design is not a good fit on the long run. I do like having a real GNU system and a terminal to play with it on my phone, but let's face it, I use the Web/GPS/Text more than the terminal, and they are not decent for a 2016 experience. It's where smarphones were 5 years ago, but with bugs. I don't regret I bought it, it was a nice experience, but now I'm going for something that will just work.
- trm42 10y ago
  Well what did you expect if you bought a phone made in 2013 and which was low-end phone with mid-level price even at that time (costed about 400 € and felt like a 200€ smart phone). Nowadays it's either Android or iPhone. Pick your poison. The specs for Jolla C are quite limited, but maybe with their OS those specs are enough. At least now they gotten better display panel (IPS) because the one of the biggest fails the first Jolla phone had, was the display. Jolla C looks like it's priced at zero-margin. They just want to have lots of developers at this point. And the 169 € sounds a lot better than 400€
jnmandal 10y ago
Real bummer that it's only for EU, Finnish and Swiss users right now.
- ptaipale 10y ago
  Norwegian. (Finland is in EU).
ZenoArrow 10y ago
The phone looks like a decent all-rounder, but I'd say they've missed out on one potential killer app. I'd say the one feature that is game changing for both Jolla and Ubuntu Phone is being able to run it as a desktop device as well as a phone. If the hardware supported USB Type C, there'd be no question that this would be my next phone, even if the desktop functionality wasn't supported at launch it would be a clear statement of intention.
- trm42 10y ago
  Well some of the new Microsoft Lumia phones had the ability to work as a desktop computer. Look how well it did for Microsoft ;p The idea is cool but the computers and smart phones are so cheap everyone has somekind of computer (or access to one) + smart phone. This would've awesome in the mid-2000s, though ;-) + Haven't seen a device that really solves different usage patters of mobile phone and desktop in the same UI. If you're going suggest Windows 8-10, I'm sorry to break it to you but they failed miserably.
  - ZenoArrow 10y ago
    > "The idea is cool but the computers and smart phones are so cheap everyone has somekind of computer (or access to one) + smart phone." I don't own a x86 PC, all I have access to are work computers and my smartphone. This is partly out of choice, I want to keep my possessions to a minimum. As for your other points, I would suggest that previous attempts have failed because they were clunky, with USB Type C the potential is there for a much better user experience. > "If you're going to suggest Windows 8-10, I'm sorry to break it to you but they failed miserably." You're treating your own opinion like a breaking news story. Nice try, but it doesn't give it any extra weight.
- Brakenshire 10y ago
  The hardware won't be up to it, and it would be a huge amount of work to build a desktop UI which matches their mobile UI. Canonical have been pursuing this for five years, and are only just about getting there.
hathym 10y ago
evrything was good until Qualcomm 212 !
luxpir 10y ago
I miss my semi-bricked n900. I know one of us always chimes in, but still, it's true. It was a very functional phone. I need to solder a USB cable onto the data-pads under the battery to retrieve some data and possibly restore it, but it served very well for 5 years. The Ubuntu phone is a tolerable placeholder. A Jolla seems like it would be just tolerable also (as per sametmax's comments) but I'll have to keep waiting for something decent and open. Also still holding out for convergence... Give it another 5 years probably!
- pessimizer 10y ago
  > I need to solder a USB cable onto the data-pads under the battery to retrieve some data You can just rsync to get the data off. That port only needs to work if you need to reimage, or you only have one battery/don't like swapping batteries every day..
  - luxpir 10y ago
    Thanks, normally that would be OK but I basically apt-get autoremoved some system utils [0] and the thing wouldn't boot again. Had been so careful for years, then one careless keystroke and I'd hosed the system. I'd reflash it, but the re-solder of the usb port finally went and took most of the PCB connectors with it. And I was careful there too, again for years. So without booting and without data connectivity, rsync won't be an option. So it's a case of (I think) soldering a new USB cable into place under the battery, charging, exfil the data, then reflash to finally have it back in business. Albeit with a rat-tail hanging out the case. -- [0] Never figured out what the utils were, but seem to recall it being part of a python dependency chain. So autoremove had somehow, probably incorrectly, thought it was OK to get rid of a key component of some kind. It was the power kernel with a bunch of mods, so probably my own fault somewhere along the line.
    - digi_owl 10y ago
      Well they are using systemd, and if one unit fails to come up in systemd, the whole thing will throw a hissy fit and go into emergency mode.
hypercluster 10y ago
I'd like for Jolla or Ubuntu to succeed with their phones but I just don't see it. I fiddled around with an Ubuntu phone for a while but stopped using it eventually. The basic funtionalities are just not as good or as stable as they should be. That would be step one. But then, especially with phones, there's a lot of innovation and those kind of phones just can't keep up.
- Brakenshire 10y ago
  I'm not sure there's all that much innovation in smartphones. Android doesn't seem to have changed all that much over the past 2-3 years, it seems to have entered a holding pattern with various small tweaks over that time. I just looked up Android N, and the first article I got back had some of the top features as new emoji and keyboard themes! It strikes me that the whole area is mature and stable, which is great, but it doesn't exactly mean they're speeding off into the distance. If they can catch up with basic functionality, web apps continue to develop and are integrated well, there's decent android app compatibility, and they can add an extra interesting feature like convergence (which requires that the next-generation hardware is fast enough), I personally would be quite enthusiastic to have an Ubuntu phone as my next smartphone.
  - hypercluster 10y ago
    True, on OS level not that much. Although things like multitasking, nightshift etc. are quite neat. Smartwear/watches are something that wouldn't get any love either. And yes, web apps need to get better to work. Android compability is nice but will never be nicely integrated (especially if dependent on Google Services). And only a fraction will develop native apps. But convergence is a killer feature, indeed!
  - Zigurd 10y ago
    Android N will enable richer multi-tasking, a richer focus model for apps, and provide desktop style mouse support, basically bridging the gap from the touch-first side, so that you get the full spectrum of usage modes from handset to desktop. Over the years Android has also made gains in multimedia, GPGPU, and graphics that most users might not be aware of but will affect the kinds of apps being developed. There are a lot of resources being applied to Android and Sailfish and other more Linuxy phone OSs will find it hard to keep up. BUT I'd still like a Linux phone and/or tablet that runs the legacy Linux apps. Then I could have a mobile device on which I could compile Android and run Android Studio for app development. That would be fun. I also think two mobile ecosystems isn't enough.
catwell 10y ago
Signed up. I had backed the tablet but since it failed I never had an opportunity to try Jolla for real, this will be it. I really think we need an alternative to the Android / iOS duopoly and I hope this is it.
paride5745 10y ago
A friend of mine is still waiting for the Tablet or a refund. Honestly, I do not trust them enough to give them my money.
- Zirro 10y ago
  Based on their blog there are no more tablets to ship, but if the words of an unfamiliar HN user mean anything to you, I can verify that I received the first half of my refund two days ago.
- hasteur 10y ago
  Also got my first half refund in my paypal acct a few days ago. Since I promised I would only strongly reccomend not getting a Jolla device for those conditions, that's what I'm saying. If you like total linkdark from your manufacturer coupled with emergency releases of news (because someone else leaked they missed a critical funding round) that leaves users even more befuddled and calling for clear feedback.
simondelacourt 10y ago
I really do not anymore understand Jolla. I have bought a Jolla Phone in the past followed by backing the tablet. The phone started slowly to annoy me more and more, mainly because of the subpar processor and the lack of memory (I had to keep killing apps to keep my browser handy). Android support is okay but notifications get delayed from time to time (for hours)... Jolla said to focus more on the software, and now they come up with this?! I really don't get this. The specs are subpar, the unique selling points (no bloatware, premium jolla support) are no different than before, and it is all made even weirder to get the product via this first come first serve idea with only a 1000 phones. Jolla has been criticized that they are crappy at opening up and telling the real deal. They really are. In the months following the tablet debacle the updates were just crappy. It was until the rebate email (with a link to get fill in your details) that I discovered that I would actually get a tablet. Somehow it was too complicate to tell the first 1000 backers per email that they would get a tablet. Jolla, get your communication act together. If you want to get people to believe in you explain your motives, explain your ideas of how the future would be. Skip the marketing bullshit, your target audience is not that much interested in hollow PR words. Be sincere, open and direct. Understand that people might be disappointed and explain the relevance of the Jolla C. But don't just act like nothing happened.
- catwell 10y ago
  The way I understand it, it is a developer phone, something for people who do not have a Sailfish device yet and want to work on apps or the OS itself while the Intex device is in the works.
- paavokoya 10y ago
  "The Future Is Open" ..... "Join Now!" I always find it funny when "open source" projects require you to join anything.
carc1n0gen 10y ago
Is there a specific reason that both Jolla phones and Ubuntu phones are not available in Canada, or North America for that matter?
- feklar 10y ago
  Not certified by FCC/Industry Canada for sale but there is a (risky) work around or just buy one off ebay https://together.jolla.com/question/78081/shipping-to-canada-jolla-phone-toh-bundle/ https://together.jolla.com/question/78081/shipping-to-canada...
- vertex-four 10y ago
  In North America, all smartphones are sold through a carrier - with very few exceptions. There's no infrastructure nor any significant consumer demand for phones sold through other methods, and it might hurt Jolla in the future if they are seen by carriers as attempting to break their stranglehold over the market. People in the rest of the world are a lot more used to paying up-front for a phone, potentially through a third party, and getting a SIM-only plan.
  - ocdtrekkie 10y ago
    I would kill to finally get an Android alternative on Verizon. Good luck with that though.
Shugyousha 10y ago
I would love to have a Sailfish OS phone but if they are not Open Sourcing their UI libraries I can't convince myself to buy it. It's a real shame because all I want is a fast, simple OpenSource phone OS (that is as responsive as iOS). AOSP is okay but it does not feel as snappy as when I tried iOS for which I blame Dalvik. There are not a lot of contenders, only Tizen, Ubuntu Phone and plasma mobile. I hope one of them will be installable on the Fairphone 2 in the near future...
- cm3 10y ago
  I don't want to sound dismissive but why is that a deciding factor over, say, an Android phone? At least the UI should be easier to make snappy with Qt underneath so I'd consider it if I were in the market for a phone.
- ocean3 10y ago
  ASOP because of gpu drivers? I have a iPad mini and one x. Both are smooth and responsive.
- fractallyte 10y ago
  If Jolla open sourced their UI technology, what would happen to the company and investors? And would Sailfish OS then be fated to suffer endless fragmentation, like Android? There's nothing terribly wrong with the closed parts of this system. Much of the phone is readily accessible to developers, and Jolla provides a lot of support. It's far more open than Android or iOS.
  - hackney 10y ago
    I don't know about open. Trying to fish for the price and they do not sell to the U.S. apparently. I would buy this phone, or something similar, if it were actually available. The thing I can't stand about android aps is that many are not available unless you login to google. It really pisses me off too. Why does my banking ap or my email provider ap have to come directly from google?? Is it that hard to host miniature files on the sites for which the apk's are designed?? My email ap says that the playstore needs to update but the apk still works even though playstore is disabled. Stupid, stupid, stupid. On the jolla phone I would install a barebones version of gapps, if at all. Right now I am using ~9 apk's I can find nowhere else but the playstore and tbh If my phone was rooted I would remove them all.
Tharkun 10y ago
I've given up on Jolla. Their OS got worse with every release. Their hardware was very sloppy (three dead batteries in a year time, design flaw which required me to keep a piece of paper under the battery to keep it in place). Their support was god awful. The only way to get my device fixed was to mail it to Finland and spend over a month without a replacement. The idea was great. They tried to keep the Maemo spirit alive. But they failed.
deanclatworthy 10y ago
I worked on the Jolla launch website over three years ago. What ever happened to "The other half" - their big idea?
- mpol 10y ago
  It seemed like an interesting way to engage tinkerers/hackers and have people come up with new ideas. But it didn't take off really much. There is only a small community, and they worked years on a half-decent keyboard. For the rest there are just some LED-based backcovers. I doubt they will ever try that again.
shmerl 10y ago
4G/LTE: 1/3/7/20 Does it mean it's incompatible with T-Mobile in US? That's just annoying. Aren't Qualcomm already making universal modems by now?
- ac29 10y ago
  Yes, it isnt compatible, but this phone isnt being sold in the US.
  - shmerl 10y ago
    Did they limit regions? "Not being sold" only means "no warranty" I suppose. N9 / N950 also weren't officially sold in US, yet they worked just fine.
ensiferum 10y ago
wow limited edition.... All the 5 people in the world interested in this must now be worried if they can get one...
t0mk 10y ago
I am too surprised they did a new phone after the tablet fiasco. I wonder how it differs from the Intex phone they showed on MWC 2016 in February. I really wonder if they think about the product name in terms of people who try to look it up. "jolla" in Finnish also means "on which" (in addition to "dinghy" or some little boat), which makes it really difficult to look up on finnish websites.

145 points by anttiviljami 10y ago

I have a Jolla phone, and used it exclusively until it met with the sidewalk and cracked the screen. The OS is a breeze to use, even if you're using Android apps. However after the whole Jolla Tablet fiasco, I am reluctant to buy more from the company.

bruce_one 10y ago

Very surprised, I hadn't anticipated this happening. (Irrationally excited too.) I'd assumed that after the tablet fiasco that Jolla wouldn't be doing any hardware for a long time. (I'm not personally grumpy in any way, but I think fiasco is the most accurate word :-s ) I'd been holding out hope for an official Fairphone 2 deal (or even the Puzzlephone), but this is awesome :-)

chappi42 10y ago
It's a 'super-pity' that the tablet failed. I have one and like it a lot! (<3 to jolla for trying to provide a more open and friendly ecosystem, wish you were a billion-euro-strong company)
walkingolof 10y ago
I assume that the investment in the hardware is very limited, likely a OEM phone with branding. Smart move for a developer phone.

tychuz 10y ago

Well, it's even less popular than Windows Phone - that's quite an achievement!

b34r 10y ago
Or Tizen, lol.
pekk 10y ago
Microsoft dumped a lot of money into making Windows Phone succeed. Jolla has the opposite problem and has not even tried to enter the US market.
RaleyField 10y ago
Windows Phone got some traction for being both Windows and because it was made by Nokia, in comparison Jolla doesn't distinguish itself that much.

mullsork 10y ago

Any Jolla/Sailfish users out there that could shed some light on their impressions so far? I'm reluctant to switch to Android or iOS but I will need to switch out my phone real soon.

shmerl 10y ago
I'm using it for everyday purposes on Nexus 5. UI usability is excellent. My only problem - the browser development is stalled and it's using outdated Gecko fork.
gulpahum 10y ago
It has a bit unusual user interface. They designed it to be usable by one hand, but I think they just ended up with a bit messy UI. It takes some time to get used to and some features are not easy to discover (like the top sliding menu or the context menu on list items). It runs its own native Sailfish apps (there's few hundred of them) and Android apps (you can install Google Play, if you follow a bit cumbersome instructions). However, the UI logic in native apps is different than in Android apps. Native apps use a lot of wiping gestures, while Android apps use more tapping and the back button. There is also a native web browser (built on top of Gecko) and it has its own UI logic (the usual web browser logic with a back button, no gestures). So, all together, it has three way to navigate, which makes the whole experience a bit fragmented. But, if you want to escape the surveillance riddled Android and iPhone, Jolla is a good basic phone. It offers a lot for hackers, because its built on top of Linux and you have access to almost everything without rooting. I got my phone three years ago and I'm still getting OS updates regularly, which is also nice. I just wish the UI was better.
- mullsork 10y ago
  Thanks for the writeup. I wouldn't mind having a very hackable phone I suppose. Does one need Linux to enjoy it at its fullest, or is OSX also okay?
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]

sametmax 10y ago

I was using a dumb phone and a change of life made me need a smartphone. A friend of mine encouraged me to get a Jolla. I liked the idea, Open Source, you can code your app in Python, compatible with Android apps, etc. At the begining, I was very tolerant with the quirks of the phone, being a FOSS believer and all. But after months and months of use, I'm getting more and more frustrated with it: - it's slow. - apps randomly crashes or don't start at all. - Android support is limited. - network is unreliable. - the performances don't allow any decent Web surf experience, and I already hate the Web on mobile so it makes things irritating for me. - it requires a lot of fiddling to adapt it to your needs. It can be good if you need customization, but some basic stuff (such as emoji) are not included by default. Some might consider that a feature, but when a girl text me a smiley when I flirt with her, I want to know what face it has because it kinda condition my next answer. - some bugs are incredibly annoying. The worst being the poor handling of group text messages which lead to very confusing conversations. A smartphone that can't text, really? - ergonomy is lacking at best. While I think there are some neat ideas, the hidden menu for simple tasks, the absence of resize in some picture mode and the presence of it in others and plenty other subtle details make it cumbersome to use even for basic stuff. The color scheme and overall design is not a good fit on the long run. I do like having a real GNU system and a terminal to play with it on my phone, but let's face it, I use the Web/GPS/Text more than the terminal, and they are not decent for a 2016 experience. It's where smarphones were 5 years ago, but with bugs. I don't regret I bought it, it was a nice experience, but now I'm going for something that will just work.

trm42 10y ago
Well what did you expect if you bought a phone made in 2013 and which was low-end phone with mid-level price even at that time (costed about 400 € and felt like a 200€ smart phone). Nowadays it's either Android or iPhone. Pick your poison. The specs for Jolla C are quite limited, but maybe with their OS those specs are enough. At least now they gotten better display panel (IPS) because the one of the biggest fails the first Jolla phone had, was the display. Jolla C looks like it's priced at zero-margin. They just want to have lots of developers at this point. And the 169 € sounds a lot better than 400€

jnmandal 10y ago

Real bummer that it's only for EU, Finnish and Swiss users right now.

ptaipale 10y ago
Norwegian. (Finland is in EU).

ZenoArrow 10y ago

The phone looks like a decent all-rounder, but I'd say they've missed out on one potential killer app. I'd say the one feature that is game changing for both Jolla and Ubuntu Phone is being able to run it as a desktop device as well as a phone. If the hardware supported USB Type C, there'd be no question that this would be my next phone, even if the desktop functionality wasn't supported at launch it would be a clear statement of intention.

trm42 10y ago
Well some of the new Microsoft Lumia phones had the ability to work as a desktop computer. Look how well it did for Microsoft ;p The idea is cool but the computers and smart phones are so cheap everyone has somekind of computer (or access to one) + smart phone. This would've awesome in the mid-2000s, though ;-) + Haven't seen a device that really solves different usage patters of mobile phone and desktop in the same UI. If you're going suggest Windows 8-10, I'm sorry to break it to you but they failed miserably.
- ZenoArrow 10y ago
  > "The idea is cool but the computers and smart phones are so cheap everyone has somekind of computer (or access to one) + smart phone." I don't own a x86 PC, all I have access to are work computers and my smartphone. This is partly out of choice, I want to keep my possessions to a minimum. As for your other points, I would suggest that previous attempts have failed because they were clunky, with USB Type C the potential is there for a much better user experience. > "If you're going to suggest Windows 8-10, I'm sorry to break it to you but they failed miserably." You're treating your own opinion like a breaking news story. Nice try, but it doesn't give it any extra weight.
Brakenshire 10y ago
The hardware won't be up to it, and it would be a huge amount of work to build a desktop UI which matches their mobile UI. Canonical have been pursuing this for five years, and are only just about getting there.

hathym 10y ago

evrything was good until Qualcomm 212 !

luxpir 10y ago

I miss my semi-bricked n900. I know one of us always chimes in, but still, it's true. It was a very functional phone. I need to solder a USB cable onto the data-pads under the battery to retrieve some data and possibly restore it, but it served very well for 5 years. The Ubuntu phone is a tolerable placeholder. A Jolla seems like it would be just tolerable also (as per sametmax's comments) but I'll have to keep waiting for something decent and open. Also still holding out for convergence... Give it another 5 years probably!

pessimizer 10y ago
> I need to solder a USB cable onto the data-pads under the battery to retrieve some data You can just rsync to get the data off. That port only needs to work if you need to reimage, or you only have one battery/don't like swapping batteries every day..
- luxpir 10y ago
  Thanks, normally that would be OK but I basically apt-get autoremoved some system utils [0] and the thing wouldn't boot again. Had been so careful for years, then one careless keystroke and I'd hosed the system. I'd reflash it, but the re-solder of the usb port finally went and took most of the PCB connectors with it. And I was careful there too, again for years. So without booting and without data connectivity, rsync won't be an option. So it's a case of (I think) soldering a new USB cable into place under the battery, charging, exfil the data, then reflash to finally have it back in business. Albeit with a rat-tail hanging out the case. -- [0] Never figured out what the utils were, but seem to recall it being part of a python dependency chain. So autoremove had somehow, probably incorrectly, thought it was OK to get rid of a key component of some kind. It was the power kernel with a bunch of mods, so probably my own fault somewhere along the line.
  - digi_owl 10y ago
    Well they are using systemd, and if one unit fails to come up in systemd, the whole thing will throw a hissy fit and go into emergency mode.

hypercluster 10y ago

I'd like for Jolla or Ubuntu to succeed with their phones but I just don't see it. I fiddled around with an Ubuntu phone for a while but stopped using it eventually. The basic funtionalities are just not as good or as stable as they should be. That would be step one. But then, especially with phones, there's a lot of innovation and those kind of phones just can't keep up.

Brakenshire 10y ago
I'm not sure there's all that much innovation in smartphones. Android doesn't seem to have changed all that much over the past 2-3 years, it seems to have entered a holding pattern with various small tweaks over that time. I just looked up Android N, and the first article I got back had some of the top features as new emoji and keyboard themes! It strikes me that the whole area is mature and stable, which is great, but it doesn't exactly mean they're speeding off into the distance. If they can catch up with basic functionality, web apps continue to develop and are integrated well, there's decent android app compatibility, and they can add an extra interesting feature like convergence (which requires that the next-generation hardware is fast enough), I personally would be quite enthusiastic to have an Ubuntu phone as my next smartphone.
- hypercluster 10y ago
  True, on OS level not that much. Although things like multitasking, nightshift etc. are quite neat. Smartwear/watches are something that wouldn't get any love either. And yes, web apps need to get better to work. Android compability is nice but will never be nicely integrated (especially if dependent on Google Services). And only a fraction will develop native apps. But convergence is a killer feature, indeed!
- Zigurd 10y ago
  Android N will enable richer multi-tasking, a richer focus model for apps, and provide desktop style mouse support, basically bridging the gap from the touch-first side, so that you get the full spectrum of usage modes from handset to desktop. Over the years Android has also made gains in multimedia, GPGPU, and graphics that most users might not be aware of but will affect the kinds of apps being developed. There are a lot of resources being applied to Android and Sailfish and other more Linuxy phone OSs will find it hard to keep up. BUT I'd still like a Linux phone and/or tablet that runs the legacy Linux apps. Then I could have a mobile device on which I could compile Android and run Android Studio for app development. That would be fun. I also think two mobile ecosystems isn't enough.

catwell 10y ago

Signed up. I had backed the tablet but since it failed I never had an opportunity to try Jolla for real, this will be it. I really think we need an alternative to the Android / iOS duopoly and I hope this is it.

paride5745 10y ago

A friend of mine is still waiting for the Tablet or a refund. Honestly, I do not trust them enough to give them my money.

Zirro 10y ago
Based on their blog there are no more tablets to ship, but if the words of an unfamiliar HN user mean anything to you, I can verify that I received the first half of my refund two days ago.
hasteur 10y ago
Also got my first half refund in my paypal acct a few days ago. Since I promised I would only strongly reccomend not getting a Jolla device for those conditions, that's what I'm saying. If you like total linkdark from your manufacturer coupled with emergency releases of news (because someone else leaked they missed a critical funding round) that leaves users even more befuddled and calling for clear feedback.

simondelacourt 10y ago

I really do not anymore understand Jolla. I have bought a Jolla Phone in the past followed by backing the tablet. The phone started slowly to annoy me more and more, mainly because of the subpar processor and the lack of memory (I had to keep killing apps to keep my browser handy). Android support is okay but notifications get delayed from time to time (for hours)... Jolla said to focus more on the software, and now they come up with this?! I really don't get this. The specs are subpar, the unique selling points (no bloatware, premium jolla support) are no different than before, and it is all made even weirder to get the product via this first come first serve idea with only a 1000 phones. Jolla has been criticized that they are crappy at opening up and telling the real deal. They really are. In the months following the tablet debacle the updates were just crappy. It was until the rebate email (with a link to get fill in your details) that I discovered that I would actually get a tablet. Somehow it was too complicate to tell the first 1000 backers per email that they would get a tablet. Jolla, get your communication act together. If you want to get people to believe in you explain your motives, explain your ideas of how the future would be. Skip the marketing bullshit, your target audience is not that much interested in hollow PR words. Be sincere, open and direct. Understand that people might be disappointed and explain the relevance of the Jolla C. But don't just act like nothing happened.

catwell 10y ago
The way I understand it, it is a developer phone, something for people who do not have a Sailfish device yet and want to work on apps or the OS itself while the Intex device is in the works.
paavokoya 10y ago
"The Future Is Open" ..... "Join Now!" I always find it funny when "open source" projects require you to join anything.

carc1n0gen 10y ago

Is there a specific reason that both Jolla phones and Ubuntu phones are not available in Canada, or North America for that matter?

feklar 10y ago
Not certified by FCC/Industry Canada for sale but there is a (risky) work around or just buy one off ebay https://together.jolla.com/question/78081/shipping-to-canada-jolla-phone-toh-bundle/ https://together.jolla.com/question/78081/shipping-to-canada...
vertex-four 10y ago
In North America, all smartphones are sold through a carrier - with very few exceptions. There's no infrastructure nor any significant consumer demand for phones sold through other methods, and it might hurt Jolla in the future if they are seen by carriers as attempting to break their stranglehold over the market. People in the rest of the world are a lot more used to paying up-front for a phone, potentially through a third party, and getting a SIM-only plan.
- ocdtrekkie 10y ago
  I would kill to finally get an Android alternative on Verizon. Good luck with that though.

Shugyousha 10y ago

I would love to have a Sailfish OS phone but if they are not Open Sourcing their UI libraries I can't convince myself to buy it. It's a real shame because all I want is a fast, simple OpenSource phone OS (that is as responsive as iOS). AOSP is okay but it does not feel as snappy as when I tried iOS for which I blame Dalvik. There are not a lot of contenders, only Tizen, Ubuntu Phone and plasma mobile. I hope one of them will be installable on the Fairphone 2 in the near future...

cm3 10y ago
I don't want to sound dismissive but why is that a deciding factor over, say, an Android phone? At least the UI should be easier to make snappy with Qt underneath so I'd consider it if I were in the market for a phone.
ocean3 10y ago
ASOP because of gpu drivers? I have a iPad mini and one x. Both are smooth and responsive.
fractallyte 10y ago
If Jolla open sourced their UI technology, what would happen to the company and investors? And would Sailfish OS then be fated to suffer endless fragmentation, like Android? There's nothing terribly wrong with the closed parts of this system. Much of the phone is readily accessible to developers, and Jolla provides a lot of support. It's far more open than Android or iOS.
- hackney 10y ago
  I don't know about open. Trying to fish for the price and they do not sell to the U.S. apparently. I would buy this phone, or something similar, if it were actually available. The thing I can't stand about android aps is that many are not available unless you login to google. It really pisses me off too. Why does my banking ap or my email provider ap have to come directly from google?? Is it that hard to host miniature files on the sites for which the apk's are designed?? My email ap says that the playstore needs to update but the apk still works even though playstore is disabled. Stupid, stupid, stupid. On the jolla phone I would install a barebones version of gapps, if at all. Right now I am using ~9 apk's I can find nowhere else but the playstore and tbh If my phone was rooted I would remove them all.

Tharkun 10y ago

I've given up on Jolla. Their OS got worse with every release. Their hardware was very sloppy (three dead batteries in a year time, design flaw which required me to keep a piece of paper under the battery to keep it in place). Their support was god awful. The only way to get my device fixed was to mail it to Finland and spend over a month without a replacement. The idea was great. They tried to keep the Maemo spirit alive. But they failed.

deanclatworthy 10y ago

I worked on the Jolla launch website over three years ago. What ever happened to "The other half" - their big idea?

mpol 10y ago
It seemed like an interesting way to engage tinkerers/hackers and have people come up with new ideas. But it didn't take off really much. There is only a small community, and they worked years on a half-decent keyboard. For the rest there are just some LED-based backcovers. I doubt they will ever try that again.

shmerl 10y ago

4G/LTE: 1/3/7/20 Does it mean it's incompatible with T-Mobile in US? That's just annoying. Aren't Qualcomm already making universal modems by now?

ac29 10y ago
Yes, it isnt compatible, but this phone isnt being sold in the US.
- shmerl 10y ago
  Did they limit regions? "Not being sold" only means "no warranty" I suppose. N9 / N950 also weren't officially sold in US, yet they worked just fine.

ensiferum 10y ago

wow limited edition.... All the 5 people in the world interested in this must now be worried if they can get one...

t0mk 10y ago

I am too surprised they did a new phone after the tablet fiasco. I wonder how it differs from the Intex phone they showed on MWC 2016 in February. I really wonder if they think about the product name in terms of people who try to look it up. "jolla" in Finnish also means "on which" (in addition to "dinghy" or some little boat), which makes it really difficult to look up on finnish websites.