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This is a major reason I'd love to own a Telsa (or car with similar features). Right now I have to avoid driving long distances at night because I have a hard t

This is a major reason I'd love to own a Telsa (or car with similar features). Right now I have to avoid driving long distances at night because I have a hard time staying awake. While I would have no intention of taking a full-on nap while on autopilot, it would make sitting behind a wheel a lot safer during long hauls between cities.

ars 10y ago
No, that would make it much LESS safe. Instead of now where you force yourself to be fully awake, instead you will allow yourself to semi-snooze, until you hit a situation the computer can't handle - and then you are in real trouble.
- toomuchtodo 10y ago
  A Tesla brings itself to a complete stop safely if you don't assume control when it required you to.
  - ars 10y ago
    You are assuming it's able to recognize that it needs to do that. And a complete stop on the freeway is not exactly safe.
  - cstejerean 10y ago
    Unless you kick your feet into the brake pedal accidentally whole dozing off and it disengages emergency braking and you plow into an object at full speed while still asleep.
- developer2 10y ago
  This is exactly why I wish these cars would be banned from being on the road at all in their current state. Some people are assuming it means you don't have to pay as much attention. In the hands of your average consumer, these cars are not safe. As an above average user of technology, I would not trust myself to remain in constant control of such a vehicle. I certainly don't trust the average or below average consumer to handle it! Most who claim they would remain attentive are not aware that they are making false claims, and this likely includes a lot of HN visitors. The better the cars get at remaining on autopilot, the more complacent drivers will become. A really good autopilot is training its users into trusting it to handle everything. If your average commute results in autopilot practically never kicking in, your brain will naturally - regardless of your intent - find something else to occupy your attention. Reading a book in your lap, checking the weather, grooming yourself in the mirror, or even just spacing out and daydreaming. Frankly I'm of the opinion that self-driving cars are something that will happen in 50+ years. When cities are built with "roads" that are actually tracks; tracks that are designed to handle only these cars and nothing else. I imagine we will not own such cars; they'll be more like subway/metro public transit systems, but with individual pods that hold a small number of people and with hundreds/thousands of small stations to embark/disembark from. These vehicles should not be allowed until there is no manual takeover. If the vehicle cannot operate at all times on autopilot, it should not be on the road.
  - arcticfox 10y ago
    Is there any evidence that these cars, abused as they are, are less safe when under autopilot than the average driver on the road? This is the only reference I've seen to that http://electrek.co/2016/04/24/tesla-autopilot-probability-accident/ http://electrek.co/2016/04/24/tesla-autopilot-probability-ac....
    - developer2 10y ago
      >> when under autopilot I care a lot about what happens when autopilot disengages. I truly and honestly believe it is a biological, psychological fact, that autopilot will result in less attentive occupants in the vehicle. We're going to blame "drivers" - who are really now just passengers, expected to sometimes take the wheel - for accidents caused by autopilots disengaging, because the driver "should have been in control". Except that most people are going to be mentally unable to maintain the kind of focus needed to be able to take over a failed autopilot. Let me put it this way: I believe that today, if my mother were to cause an accident, she would have done something tangible to be deserving of being "at fault". In a future where my mother can be considered at fault for killing someone because she failed to take over an autopilot in under a second... that is not a future I want to experience. I'm afraid of the moment we begin blaming people for loss of life caused by technology expecting us to interfere when it is innately difficult to do so.
  - sinxoveretothex 10y ago
    One time I saw a car driving very erratically through an intersection and going into a reserved lane they were not allowed to. The driver was texting while driving. I've seen more instances since then. If you ask me, people can't be trusted to be safe anyway. I'd rather have imperfect autonomous cars than people driving.
- kendallpark 10y ago
  I disagree. It would be like having a copilot that stays awake with a driver to make sure the driver is okay. Say that once every ten minutes, you nod off for a half second. The probability of the car's autopilot failing at that same exact time is far less than the probability that half second of lost awareness could cause an accident if there was no autopilot. No one is advocating actually sleeping at the wheel, I thought my OP was clear about that.

ars 10y ago

No, that would make it much LESS safe. Instead of now where you force yourself to be fully awake, instead you will allow yourself to semi-snooze, until you hit a situation the computer can't handle - and then you are in real trouble.

toomuchtodo 10y ago
A Tesla brings itself to a complete stop safely if you don't assume control when it required you to.
- ars 10y ago
  You are assuming it's able to recognize that it needs to do that. And a complete stop on the freeway is not exactly safe.
- cstejerean 10y ago
  Unless you kick your feet into the brake pedal accidentally whole dozing off and it disengages emergency braking and you plow into an object at full speed while still asleep.
developer2 10y ago
This is exactly why I wish these cars would be banned from being on the road at all in their current state. Some people are assuming it means you don't have to pay as much attention. In the hands of your average consumer, these cars are not safe. As an above average user of technology, I would not trust myself to remain in constant control of such a vehicle. I certainly don't trust the average or below average consumer to handle it! Most who claim they would remain attentive are not aware that they are making false claims, and this likely includes a lot of HN visitors. The better the cars get at remaining on autopilot, the more complacent drivers will become. A really good autopilot is training its users into trusting it to handle everything. If your average commute results in autopilot practically never kicking in, your brain will naturally - regardless of your intent - find something else to occupy your attention. Reading a book in your lap, checking the weather, grooming yourself in the mirror, or even just spacing out and daydreaming. Frankly I'm of the opinion that self-driving cars are something that will happen in 50+ years. When cities are built with "roads" that are actually tracks; tracks that are designed to handle only these cars and nothing else. I imagine we will not own such cars; they'll be more like subway/metro public transit systems, but with individual pods that hold a small number of people and with hundreds/thousands of small stations to embark/disembark from. These vehicles should not be allowed until there is no manual takeover. If the vehicle cannot operate at all times on autopilot, it should not be on the road.
- arcticfox 10y ago
  Is there any evidence that these cars, abused as they are, are less safe when under autopilot than the average driver on the road? This is the only reference I've seen to that http://electrek.co/2016/04/24/tesla-autopilot-probability-accident/ http://electrek.co/2016/04/24/tesla-autopilot-probability-ac....
  - developer2 10y ago
    >> when under autopilot I care a lot about what happens when autopilot disengages. I truly and honestly believe it is a biological, psychological fact, that autopilot will result in less attentive occupants in the vehicle. We're going to blame "drivers" - who are really now just passengers, expected to sometimes take the wheel - for accidents caused by autopilots disengaging, because the driver "should have been in control". Except that most people are going to be mentally unable to maintain the kind of focus needed to be able to take over a failed autopilot. Let me put it this way: I believe that today, if my mother were to cause an accident, she would have done something tangible to be deserving of being "at fault". In a future where my mother can be considered at fault for killing someone because she failed to take over an autopilot in under a second... that is not a future I want to experience. I'm afraid of the moment we begin blaming people for loss of life caused by technology expecting us to interfere when it is innately difficult to do so.
- sinxoveretothex 10y ago
  One time I saw a car driving very erratically through an intersection and going into a reserved lane they were not allowed to. The driver was texting while driving. I've seen more instances since then. If you ask me, people can't be trusted to be safe anyway. I'd rather have imperfect autonomous cars than people driving.
kendallpark 10y ago
I disagree. It would be like having a copilot that stays awake with a driver to make sure the driver is okay. Say that once every ten minutes, you nod off for a half second. The probability of the car's autopilot failing at that same exact time is far less than the probability that half second of lost awareness could cause an accident if there was no autopilot. No one is advocating actually sleeping at the wheel, I thought my OP was clear about that.