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http://www.computerworld.com/article/3070460/windows-pcs/microsoft-makes-final-aggressive-windows-10-upgrade-push.html http://www.computerworld.com/article/3070

http://www.computerworld.com/article/3070460/windows-pcs/microsoft-makes-final-aggressive-windows-10-upgrade-push.html http://www.computerworld.com/article/3070460/windows-pcs/mic...

userbinator 10y ago
the upgrade and its scheduled implementation is approved when the user either clicks the "OK" button or the "X" in the upper right corner of the notification This reminds me the many stories about those shady popups that show a fake dialog box where clicking on the 'X' in an attempt to close it actually does something very, very unintended, perhaps even downloading and running some sort of malware. MS is getting pretty desperate.
joosters 10y ago
I despise Microsoft for this. Two days ago, my dad accidentally triggered an upgrade to Windows 10. In a panic, he switched the computer off, and now it no longer boots. It's now down to me to repair the computer. Apparently, months of dismissing the pop up invitations to upgrade to Windows 10 were not enough for Microsoft, they had to go and practically force it down people's throats. And my family is paying the price. Microsoft, you are utter scum. You have wasted my time, my dad's time, and cost him hours of lost work.
- ekianjo 10y ago
  Time to consider an OS change maybe?
  - joosters 10y ago
    I wish I could, but you and I both know that's a massive amount of time and work.
  - willtim 10y ago
    If only it were that simple. Even if we restrict ourselves to open cross platform software, hardware support remains a big issue. I have a Skylake laptop with which I daisy chain two external monitors via displayport. Linux doesn't even support Skylake properly, let alone my dual monitor configuration.
    - Grishnakh 10y ago
      >I have a Skylake laptop with which I daisy chain two external monitors via displayport. Linux doesn't even support Skylake properly, let alone my dual monitor configuration. And how many normal users actually do stuff like this?
  - scholia 10y ago
    Given the number of large organizations that appear to have been paralyzed for much of a decade by the problems of switching from XP/IE6 to Windows 7/IE11, a whole new OS might be a bit of a challenge.....
    - Grishnakh 10y ago
      What's really weird is that these same large organizations didn't have that much trouble migrating computing platforms in the past: MS-DOS, Win3.x, Win95, Win98, Win2000, etc. Then they got to XP and suddenly they were stuck.
      - cpeterso 10y ago
        They probably saw diminish returns upgrading from XP to Windows 7, whereas the past upgrades you list add a lot of new functionality and applications. Windows was pretty much "feature complete" with XP.
        scholia 10y ago
        Delaying the move to Windows 7 cost them vast amounts of money due to more frequent crashes and reboots, less efficient operations, greater susceptibility to malware, and generally higher support costs etc. It didn't save them any money because they were almost always paying for Windows 7 even while they were using XP. (Either they paid for Windows 7 and used the downgrade option or paid for it via Software Assurance.) They didn't save the cost of moving to Windows 7, they just deferred it to a later date when the move was more expensive. Microsoft tried to help them to move by giving them a free copy of Windows XP in the form of Windows 7 XP Mode. That wasn't available in Windows 8/8.1/10. So, as far as I can see, sticking with XP was a really dumb move. I'm sure there would be special cases connected with software that couldn't be upgraded and/or expensive peripherals, but still, in the bast majority of cases, they could have done a Windows 7 upgrade leaving just a few instances of XP.
- LionessLover 10y ago
  I'm just curious because I really don't know more than my own sample-of-1 experience: Don't you have to agree to "Terms and conditions" before the Windows 10 installation actually starts? I actually re-enabled the Windows 10 upgrade warnings on my Windows 7 desktop, because I intend to upgrade in the last week of the upgrade being free. My desktop (Dell XPS 8500 from 2012) is not supported with Windows 10 (the first time I have to say "Dell, you suck!" - I've had 5 systems from them, desktops and laptops, and a few monitors up to 32 inches), and with my XPS (9333) 13 laptop (which Dell supports with Windows 10) I had pretty much unsolvable (Realtek) sound crash issues. So anyway, just two days ago after reenabling the Windows 10 upgrade warning it started installing it on its own, as you say - but it first asked me if I agree to the "terms and conditions". I clicked "disagree" and the upgrade was canceled. So from my own experience I can't see that Microsoft installs Windows 10 without an option to stop the process? I also have not been bothered with another attempt of auto-installation in the days since, but that's probably going to happen after an actual reboot - thus far I've only used "suspend to disk" to switch the PC off.
  - joosters 10y ago
    I honestly don't know, I didn't get to see what dialogs appeared. Bear in mind that computers often get us to accept terms and conditions, and virtually no-one reads them before clicking OK. There's no way I could blame my parents if that's what they did. Hell, most of my security advice to them is explaining what is a 'legitimate' message box is and what isn't (Quick test: try describing it yourself, the many varied OS / browser / A/V popups, v.s. the scammy fake dialogs that appear.)
    - LionessLover 10y ago
      I know the feeling. My mother's approach to computing is infuriating: If she would just READ the often perfectly simple message on the screen she could solve 90% of her problems. For the same reason as your parents ending up with Windows 10 my mother managed to install the pay-version of the free anti-virus software I had installed - when it asked here if she wanted to upgrade to the non-free version she clicked on "Yes" and then didn't dare to cancel the process... It seems that in some people anything unexpected happening on the screen causes some of their inhibitory neurons to fire action potentials (only 10% of neurons in the brain, but an inhibitory signal has a much stronger effect than an excitatory one) - blocking entire brain circuits from contributing their output. It's probably an ancient fear response. So the best solution isn't to educate them - that's mostly unnecessary, since their intellectual capacity is not really the problem. One would have to get them to relax, so that unexpected things happening on their computer screen don't trigger the blocking of all reason.
- ChicagoDave 10y ago
  I manage my ex-wife's PC using TeamViewer and just regularly check updates to see what's up and to make sure MalwareBytes is running and up to date. This prevents her (and my kids) from doing "bad things". A proactive approach is better than complaining about Microsoft, whose model has changed whether you like it or not. Windows is a service now. Not a product. The more quickly we accept that (or switch OS's), the happier we'll be.
  - oarsinsync 10y ago
    Not really fair to blame the end-user / victim, who bought a product. Requiring business-level IT policies and monitoring on home/consumer IT products isn't really viable for the vast majority. Windows 10 might be a service, but previous versions were products.
  - joosters 10y ago
    Does TeamViewer prevent someone from desperately powering off a machine because they don't know to stop an update? I can't see how your advice would have helped here.

http://www.computerworld.com/article/3070460/windows-pcs/microsoft-makes-final-aggressive-windows-10-upgrade-push.html http://www.computerworld.com/article/3070460/windows-pcs/mic...

userbinator 10y ago

the upgrade and its scheduled implementation is approved when the user either clicks the "OK" button or the "X" in the upper right corner of the notification This reminds me the many stories about those shady popups that show a fake dialog box where clicking on the 'X' in an attempt to close it actually does something very, very unintended, perhaps even downloading and running some sort of malware. MS is getting pretty desperate.

joosters 10y ago

I despise Microsoft for this. Two days ago, my dad accidentally triggered an upgrade to Windows 10. In a panic, he switched the computer off, and now it no longer boots. It's now down to me to repair the computer. Apparently, months of dismissing the pop up invitations to upgrade to Windows 10 were not enough for Microsoft, they had to go and practically force it down people's throats. And my family is paying the price. Microsoft, you are utter scum. You have wasted my time, my dad's time, and cost him hours of lost work.

ekianjo 10y ago
Time to consider an OS change maybe?
- joosters 10y ago
  I wish I could, but you and I both know that's a massive amount of time and work.
- willtim 10y ago
  If only it were that simple. Even if we restrict ourselves to open cross platform software, hardware support remains a big issue. I have a Skylake laptop with which I daisy chain two external monitors via displayport. Linux doesn't even support Skylake properly, let alone my dual monitor configuration.
  - Grishnakh 10y ago
    >I have a Skylake laptop with which I daisy chain two external monitors via displayport. Linux doesn't even support Skylake properly, let alone my dual monitor configuration. And how many normal users actually do stuff like this?
- scholia 10y ago
  Given the number of large organizations that appear to have been paralyzed for much of a decade by the problems of switching from XP/IE6 to Windows 7/IE11, a whole new OS might be a bit of a challenge.....
  - Grishnakh 10y ago
    What's really weird is that these same large organizations didn't have that much trouble migrating computing platforms in the past: MS-DOS, Win3.x, Win95, Win98, Win2000, etc. Then they got to XP and suddenly they were stuck.
    - cpeterso 10y ago
      They probably saw diminish returns upgrading from XP to Windows 7, whereas the past upgrades you list add a lot of new functionality and applications. Windows was pretty much "feature complete" with XP.
      - scholia 10y ago
        Delaying the move to Windows 7 cost them vast amounts of money due to more frequent crashes and reboots, less efficient operations, greater susceptibility to malware, and generally higher support costs etc. It didn't save them any money because they were almost always paying for Windows 7 even while they were using XP. (Either they paid for Windows 7 and used the downgrade option or paid for it via Software Assurance.) They didn't save the cost of moving to Windows 7, they just deferred it to a later date when the move was more expensive. Microsoft tried to help them to move by giving them a free copy of Windows XP in the form of Windows 7 XP Mode. That wasn't available in Windows 8/8.1/10. So, as far as I can see, sticking with XP was a really dumb move. I'm sure there would be special cases connected with software that couldn't be upgraded and/or expensive peripherals, but still, in the bast majority of cases, they could have done a Windows 7 upgrade leaving just a few instances of XP.
LionessLover 10y ago
I'm just curious because I really don't know more than my own sample-of-1 experience: Don't you have to agree to "Terms and conditions" before the Windows 10 installation actually starts? I actually re-enabled the Windows 10 upgrade warnings on my Windows 7 desktop, because I intend to upgrade in the last week of the upgrade being free. My desktop (Dell XPS 8500 from 2012) is not supported with Windows 10 (the first time I have to say "Dell, you suck!" - I've had 5 systems from them, desktops and laptops, and a few monitors up to 32 inches), and with my XPS (9333) 13 laptop (which Dell supports with Windows 10) I had pretty much unsolvable (Realtek) sound crash issues. So anyway, just two days ago after reenabling the Windows 10 upgrade warning it started installing it on its own, as you say - but it first asked me if I agree to the "terms and conditions". I clicked "disagree" and the upgrade was canceled. So from my own experience I can't see that Microsoft installs Windows 10 without an option to stop the process? I also have not been bothered with another attempt of auto-installation in the days since, but that's probably going to happen after an actual reboot - thus far I've only used "suspend to disk" to switch the PC off.
- joosters 10y ago
  I honestly don't know, I didn't get to see what dialogs appeared. Bear in mind that computers often get us to accept terms and conditions, and virtually no-one reads them before clicking OK. There's no way I could blame my parents if that's what they did. Hell, most of my security advice to them is explaining what is a 'legitimate' message box is and what isn't (Quick test: try describing it yourself, the many varied OS / browser / A/V popups, v.s. the scammy fake dialogs that appear.)
  - LionessLover 10y ago
    I know the feeling. My mother's approach to computing is infuriating: If she would just READ the often perfectly simple message on the screen she could solve 90% of her problems. For the same reason as your parents ending up with Windows 10 my mother managed to install the pay-version of the free anti-virus software I had installed - when it asked here if she wanted to upgrade to the non-free version she clicked on "Yes" and then didn't dare to cancel the process... It seems that in some people anything unexpected happening on the screen causes some of their inhibitory neurons to fire action potentials (only 10% of neurons in the brain, but an inhibitory signal has a much stronger effect than an excitatory one) - blocking entire brain circuits from contributing their output. It's probably an ancient fear response. So the best solution isn't to educate them - that's mostly unnecessary, since their intellectual capacity is not really the problem. One would have to get them to relax, so that unexpected things happening on their computer screen don't trigger the blocking of all reason.
ChicagoDave 10y ago
I manage my ex-wife's PC using TeamViewer and just regularly check updates to see what's up and to make sure MalwareBytes is running and up to date. This prevents her (and my kids) from doing "bad things". A proactive approach is better than complaining about Microsoft, whose model has changed whether you like it or not. Windows is a service now. Not a product. The more quickly we accept that (or switch OS's), the happier we'll be.
- oarsinsync 10y ago
  Not really fair to blame the end-user / victim, who bought a product. Requiring business-level IT policies and monitoring on home/consumer IT products isn't really viable for the vast majority. Windows 10 might be a service, but previous versions were products.
- joosters 10y ago
  Does TeamViewer prevent someone from desperately powering off a machine because they don't know to stop an update? I can't see how your advice would have helped here.