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What do you see as the 'gaping flaws' of a pure electric vehicle? I would never want a hybrid, as I would optimize for either an ICE or EV but there doesn't see

What do you see as the 'gaping flaws' of a pure electric vehicle? I would never want a hybrid, as I would optimize for either an ICE or EV but there doesn't seem to be space in a consumer vehicle to have a workable hybrid that is better than either of its pureplay counterparts.

Spooky23 10y ago
A few: - Road trips. Range needs to accommodate the 95th percentile trip, not the mean. - Apartment living - Unknown depreciation curve The other inconvenient fact is that you need to drive a lot for the TCO of an electric car to be lower than a similar gasoline car.
- brownbat 10y ago
  - Road trips. Someone should make a novel rental program where you can swap an electric for a fresh one every 200 miles or so, like getting fresh horses. It would let more people try the vehicles while also offering a faster solution for road trips (assuming Tesla owners would get a significant discount).
- IanCal 10y ago
  Median daily distance is actually close to about 30 miles in the US. I'd be surprised if the 95th percentile (equating to more than once per month) wasn't already within the range of a Tesla, though the report doesn't have that figure. https://www.aaafoundation.org/american-driving-survey-year-one https://www.aaafoundation.org/american-driving-survey-year-o...
  - Spooky23 10y ago
    I travel regularly to NYC from Albany (about 150 miles). Many other people do as well, based on the NYC->ALB traffic you see on weekend evenings. It's a trip that is definitely in the range of a Tesla from a point A to point B point of view -- but you end up with lots of overhead. Did I fully charge before the trip? Will I do a side trip? Will I drive around when I get there? The electric car adds a lot of complication, and doesn't really solve any problem right now. Its similar to the decision process of common carrier vs. car for any moderate/long range trip.
    - vonklaus 10y ago
      I want to say straight out, I agree that range-anxiety is real. People need to be comfortable that the car will be able to go wherever they need to go, whenever they need to do there. That is, at least in America, the cultural equivocation that driving === freedom. That said, this statement: > The electric car adds a lot of complication, and doesn't really solve any problem right now. leaves me obligated to point out a few things. I will reason from analogy for point: 1. I just quit smoking, it wasn't obvious that it solved a problem right now, but I hope it will eliminate some later ;). 2. It doesn't matter, at least by Tesla's conception, that electric cars solve anything. Obviously, it is a mission driven company but that mission doesn't/shouldn't matter to the end user. Electric cars should be great for their own sake, and as good or better than a comprably priced ICE.
snuxoll 10y ago
> workable hybrid that is better than either of its pureplay counterparts. I don't really need my Prius to be better than an EV or a pure ICE, I just need something that works with existing infrastructure (not much EV infrastructure in Idaho where I live, and we make semi-regular trips to nothern Idaho to visit family) while getting decent fuel economy and reliability. Actually, now that I think about it, from a reliability aspect my Prius trumps conventional ICE engines. The much simpler design of the Atkinson cycle engine, since it can sacrifice torque that the MG's can compensate for, leads to some pretty impressive durability and a relatively cheap replacement should it be necessary - it's much more likely (guaranteed, really) that I will need to replace the battery pack before I hit 300K miles but the engine and MG's will last until the car falls apart.

Spooky23 10y ago

A few: - Road trips. Range needs to accommodate the 95th percentile trip, not the mean. - Apartment living - Unknown depreciation curve The other inconvenient fact is that you need to drive a lot for the TCO of an electric car to be lower than a similar gasoline car.

brownbat 10y ago
- Road trips. Someone should make a novel rental program where you can swap an electric for a fresh one every 200 miles or so, like getting fresh horses. It would let more people try the vehicles while also offering a faster solution for road trips (assuming Tesla owners would get a significant discount).
IanCal 10y ago
Median daily distance is actually close to about 30 miles in the US. I'd be surprised if the 95th percentile (equating to more than once per month) wasn't already within the range of a Tesla, though the report doesn't have that figure. https://www.aaafoundation.org/american-driving-survey-year-one https://www.aaafoundation.org/american-driving-survey-year-o...
- Spooky23 10y ago
  I travel regularly to NYC from Albany (about 150 miles). Many other people do as well, based on the NYC->ALB traffic you see on weekend evenings. It's a trip that is definitely in the range of a Tesla from a point A to point B point of view -- but you end up with lots of overhead. Did I fully charge before the trip? Will I do a side trip? Will I drive around when I get there? The electric car adds a lot of complication, and doesn't really solve any problem right now. Its similar to the decision process of common carrier vs. car for any moderate/long range trip.
  - vonklaus 10y ago
    I want to say straight out, I agree that range-anxiety is real. People need to be comfortable that the car will be able to go wherever they need to go, whenever they need to do there. That is, at least in America, the cultural equivocation that driving === freedom. That said, this statement: > The electric car adds a lot of complication, and doesn't really solve any problem right now. leaves me obligated to point out a few things. I will reason from analogy for point: 1. I just quit smoking, it wasn't obvious that it solved a problem right now, but I hope it will eliminate some later ;). 2. It doesn't matter, at least by Tesla's conception, that electric cars solve anything. Obviously, it is a mission driven company but that mission doesn't/shouldn't matter to the end user. Electric cars should be great for their own sake, and as good or better than a comprably priced ICE.

snuxoll 10y ago

> workable hybrid that is better than either of its pureplay counterparts. I don't really need my Prius to be better than an EV or a pure ICE, I just need something that works with existing infrastructure (not much EV infrastructure in Idaho where I live, and we make semi-regular trips to nothern Idaho to visit family) while getting decent fuel economy and reliability. Actually, now that I think about it, from a reliability aspect my Prius trumps conventional ICE engines. The much simpler design of the Atkinson cycle engine, since it can sacrifice torque that the MG's can compensate for, leads to some pretty impressive durability and a relatively cheap replacement should it be necessary - it's much more likely (guaranteed, really) that I will need to replace the battery pack before I hit 300K miles but the engine and MG's will last until the car falls apart.