5 ms·

122 acres for $1M plus $5M a year does not sound like a deal, especially given the RF ban.

by nxzero 10y ago

maxerickson 10y ago
That's why it's so cheap. Just building 80 homes could easily be $8 million dollars.
- nxzero 10y ago
  Aside from the NSA, who would have a need to have 80 (likely very old) homes on a 122 acres on the middle of nowhere with an RF ban. Homes make the property worth less, not more. Demolition costs alone would likely be in the millions and quick search of comparable land prices in the area shows this is over priced.
  - maxerickson 10y ago
    That's what the GSA is tasked with figuring out. The higher price than the surroundings makes it obvious that they are hoping the facilities make the property worth more to the buyer.
  - Thriptic 10y ago
    A cult / survivalist group?
  - Someone 10y ago
    The people with "Electromagnetic hypersensitivity" (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_questionable_diseases https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_questionable_disease...) living next door? http://theweek.com/articles/481731/west-virginias-colony-wifi-refugees http://theweek.com/articles/481731/west-virginias-colony-wif...: The village of Green Bank — population 143 — has become a mecca for people who believe their lives have been disrupted by EHS. Until she moved to Green Bank, Diane Schou lived in a shielded metal cage to try and alleviate her EHS symptoms. "Living here allows me to be more of a normal person," says Schou, as quoted by BBC News. "I can be outdoors. I don't have to stay hidden"
throwaway76543 10y ago
Agreed it's not particularly cheap at all. Average cropland per-acre cost is $4k per acre, which prices 122 acres at under $500k. If you want cheap acerage in the woods you can get it for around $1k/acre - expect to spend around $150k in total. Hell, for $1,700/ac you can buy a 160 acre plot within driving distance of Silicon Valley out by Mt. Hamilton: https://www.redfin.com/CA/Newman/5-W-of-Hwy-95360/home/22910528 https://www.redfin.com/CA/Newman/5-W-of-Hwy-95360/home/22910... These old 160ac homestead plots come up for sale periodically out there and they're quite cheap. Much, much less than a three hour drive from say, Palo Alto. Now, about that water ...
- randomdata 10y ago
  Farmland fetches $15,000-20,000 per acre around here. $1M sounds cheap, if the land is any good.
  - bhickey 10y ago
    Up in Vermont you can get timberland for $1-$3k acre. After you account for the lumber the dirt looks like it has negative value.
    - someguydave 10y ago
      Sure, raw land is a liability to a degree - folks could go and hurt themselves on it and sue you, etc.
      - throwaway76543 10y ago
        Tax liability as well. Holding land and doing nothing with it costs money.
- someguydave 10y ago
  The listing says "benefits from the Williamson Act" which apparently means that the property cannot be developed for some period of time - which probably explains the low price.
bradleyjg 10y ago
The $5m a year is if you want to maintain the extensive grounds and can't beat the federal government on upkeep costs.
- jonnathanson 10y ago
  I imagine a savvy and well connected buyer could persuade the feds either to pay for demolition and clearing of existing facilities or to subsidize upkeep. All of this in exchange for this favor or that permission, etc. Shit, I bet there are developers connected enough to lease or buy from Agency A and lease or sublease facilities to Agency B, creating an arbitrage opportunity. Mark my words: the gov will end up, on a net basis, paying some rich guy to take this off their hands.
tombone12 10y ago
Good place for a radio telescope though. And you can probably sell observation of known radio sources to the Russians and Chinese for a bit of money; I imagine it is useful for something to know the site properties of a NSA listening station.
- walrus01 10y ago
  The people who do satellite SIGINT for non-five-eyes nations don't need to be told this, they already know. For listening to geostationary satellites it's fairly basic criteria, simply, be in a low population area that is RF quiet. The parabolic dish antennas at 9 meters+ are very, very directional.

122 acres for $1M plus $5M a year does not sound like a deal, especially given the RF ban.

by nxzero 10y ago

122 acres for $1M plus $5M a year does not sound like a deal, especially given the RF ban.

maxerickson 10y ago

That's why it's so cheap. Just building 80 homes could easily be $8 million dollars.

nxzero 10y ago
Aside from the NSA, who would have a need to have 80 (likely very old) homes on a 122 acres on the middle of nowhere with an RF ban. Homes make the property worth less, not more. Demolition costs alone would likely be in the millions and quick search of comparable land prices in the area shows this is over priced.
- maxerickson 10y ago
  That's what the GSA is tasked with figuring out. The higher price than the surroundings makes it obvious that they are hoping the facilities make the property worth more to the buyer.
- Thriptic 10y ago
  A cult / survivalist group?
- Someone 10y ago
  The people with "Electromagnetic hypersensitivity" (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_questionable_diseases https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_questionable_disease...) living next door? http://theweek.com/articles/481731/west-virginias-colony-wifi-refugees http://theweek.com/articles/481731/west-virginias-colony-wif...: The village of Green Bank — population 143 — has become a mecca for people who believe their lives have been disrupted by EHS. Until she moved to Green Bank, Diane Schou lived in a shielded metal cage to try and alleviate her EHS symptoms. "Living here allows me to be more of a normal person," says Schou, as quoted by BBC News. "I can be outdoors. I don't have to stay hidden"

throwaway76543 10y ago

Agreed it's not particularly cheap at all. Average cropland per-acre cost is $4k per acre, which prices 122 acres at under $500k. If you want cheap acerage in the woods you can get it for around $1k/acre - expect to spend around $150k in total. Hell, for $1,700/ac you can buy a 160 acre plot within driving distance of Silicon Valley out by Mt. Hamilton: https://www.redfin.com/CA/Newman/5-W-of-Hwy-95360/home/22910528 https://www.redfin.com/CA/Newman/5-W-of-Hwy-95360/home/22910... These old 160ac homestead plots come up for sale periodically out there and they're quite cheap. Much, much less than a three hour drive from say, Palo Alto. Now, about that water ...

randomdata 10y ago
Farmland fetches $15,000-20,000 per acre around here. $1M sounds cheap, if the land is any good.
- bhickey 10y ago
  Up in Vermont you can get timberland for $1-$3k acre. After you account for the lumber the dirt looks like it has negative value.
  - someguydave 10y ago
    Sure, raw land is a liability to a degree - folks could go and hurt themselves on it and sue you, etc.
    - throwaway76543 10y ago
      Tax liability as well. Holding land and doing nothing with it costs money.
someguydave 10y ago
The listing says "benefits from the Williamson Act" which apparently means that the property cannot be developed for some period of time - which probably explains the low price.

bradleyjg 10y ago

The $5m a year is if you want to maintain the extensive grounds and can't beat the federal government on upkeep costs.

jonnathanson 10y ago
I imagine a savvy and well connected buyer could persuade the feds either to pay for demolition and clearing of existing facilities or to subsidize upkeep. All of this in exchange for this favor or that permission, etc. Shit, I bet there are developers connected enough to lease or buy from Agency A and lease or sublease facilities to Agency B, creating an arbitrage opportunity. Mark my words: the gov will end up, on a net basis, paying some rich guy to take this off their hands.

tombone12 10y ago

Good place for a radio telescope though. And you can probably sell observation of known radio sources to the Russians and Chinese for a bit of money; I imagine it is useful for something to know the site properties of a NSA listening station.

walrus01 10y ago
The people who do satellite SIGINT for non-five-eyes nations don't need to be told this, they already know. For listening to geostationary satellites it's fairly basic criteria, simply, be in a low population area that is RF quiet. The parabolic dish antennas at 9 meters+ are very, very directional.