3 ms·

This is factually incorrect on two grounds: First, the adoption of Chip & Pin in Europe predates the European Union. Second, credit card fraud in Europe, France

This is factually incorrect on two grounds: First, the adoption of Chip & Pin in Europe predates the European Union. Second, credit card fraud in Europe, France in particular, was out of control before its adoption. I believe it was either a French or Swiss researcher that developed the technology in response.

pcl 10y ago
My understanding is that French (and presumably other European) banks assigned the liability for fraud to the account holder, whereas in the US, liability for fraudulent credit card charges falls to the banks and the credit card processing networks. This meant that individual account holders were much more tolerant of chip-and-pin technology, and demanded additional security features like portable card readers, which mean that the credit card never leaves the account holder's possession.
- ams6110 10y ago
  In the US the liability for fraud is on the merchant accepting the card.
  - jessriedel 10y ago
    This is mostly false. In the past, the liability was completely on the bank. In October, it switched to the merchant only if the merchant hadn't upgraded to a chip reader. The switchover process is continuing, and when it is complete the liability will be with the banks, as it was before.
    - sokoloff 10y ago
      It's been a while, but I seem to recall in a past company that for card-not-present transactions, the risk of fraud was on us, not on the bank approving the transaction.
- jessriedel 10y ago
  Do you have a source for this? Lite googling suggests this isn't true now in the UK (e.g., http://www.theukcardsassociation.org.uk/faqs/ http://www.theukcardsassociation.org.uk/faqs/ ) and I can't find any evidence it was true in the past. Edit: it's also not true in France now: http://www.french-property.com/guides/france/finance-taxation/banking/bank-cards/ http://www.french-property.com/guides/france/finance-taxatio...
occamrazor 10y ago
Chip and pin does not predate the EU. Debit cards used to be swipe and pin since the 80's, credit cards were not so widely used and supported both pin and signature.
occamrazor 10y ago
Chip and pin does not predate the EU. Debit cards used to be swipe and pin since the 80's, credit cards were not so widely used and supported both pin and signature.

pcl 10y ago

My understanding is that French (and presumably other European) banks assigned the liability for fraud to the account holder, whereas in the US, liability for fraudulent credit card charges falls to the banks and the credit card processing networks. This meant that individual account holders were much more tolerant of chip-and-pin technology, and demanded additional security features like portable card readers, which mean that the credit card never leaves the account holder's possession.

ams6110 10y ago
In the US the liability for fraud is on the merchant accepting the card.
- jessriedel 10y ago
  This is mostly false. In the past, the liability was completely on the bank. In October, it switched to the merchant only if the merchant hadn't upgraded to a chip reader. The switchover process is continuing, and when it is complete the liability will be with the banks, as it was before.
  - sokoloff 10y ago
    It's been a while, but I seem to recall in a past company that for card-not-present transactions, the risk of fraud was on us, not on the bank approving the transaction.
jessriedel 10y ago
Do you have a source for this? Lite googling suggests this isn't true now in the UK (e.g., http://www.theukcardsassociation.org.uk/faqs/ http://www.theukcardsassociation.org.uk/faqs/ ) and I can't find any evidence it was true in the past. Edit: it's also not true in France now: http://www.french-property.com/guides/france/finance-taxation/banking/bank-cards/ http://www.french-property.com/guides/france/finance-taxatio...

occamrazor 10y ago

Chip and pin does not predate the EU. Debit cards used to be swipe and pin since the 80's, credit cards were not so widely used and supported both pin and signature.

occamrazor 10y ago

Chip and pin does not predate the EU. Debit cards used to be swipe and pin since the 80's, credit cards were not so widely used and supported both pin and signature.