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> There are many working class people who have unconscionable commutes into Manhattan partly because of NIMBY zoning laws. Why are these people so eager to wor

> There are many working class people who have unconscionable commutes into Manhattan partly because of NIMBY zoning laws. Why are these people so eager to work in Manhattan if working there sucks so much? If employees refused to work in places with unacceptable commutes, employers will create other places to work. If enough people want to "live the dream" or have some reason they Absolutely Must Work in Manhattan, all the dressage in the world won't stop it from becoming intolerable.

swagasaurus-rex 10y ago
While capitalism tends to balance itself out, zoning laws aren't as flexible. It's a fine line between inconvenient to intolerable, as more and more people living in San Francisco are discovering.
cauterized 10y ago
Because an office in Manhattan gives you access to talent from the entire heavily populated (20 million) and relatively well educated NY metro area. (Which in turn grows because highly educated people are drawn there for employment opportunities. Positive feedback cycle.) An office in SmallTown USA gives you access to the talent of the 10,000 people who live in SmallTown and an additional 10,000 people who live in the vicinity and are willing to drive 30-60 minutes to your office. And anyone who's educated and had a choice has moved to a larger city.
- danielweber 10y ago
  > And anyone who's educated and had a choice has moved to a larger city. If they've rationally moved to the larger city, I don't see why anyone should cater to their problems. You can't have it both ways, where people are rationally moving to cities but also surprisingly victimized by cruel city commute times. Also, there is also plenty of room between SmallTown and New York City. It's a strawman to think the alternate to to Manhattan is a town of 10,000.
  - cauterized 10y ago
    Sure there's in between sizes, but the population willing to commute to a suburb of NYC is also small relative to the city proper; as is the population available to a mid-size city (which may have commute time problems of its own and doesn't have the employment draw of the hugest cities). And people may both move irrationally in search of employment and move rationally despite huge commute times (if the greater chance at a higher income outweighs the commute time for you). Or you may move based on rational principles but incorrect premises about how long you'll have to commute. Or move despite a long commute with the expectation that working in the city will give you chances to advance in your career and soon be able to afford a shorter commute.

swagasaurus-rex 10y ago

While capitalism tends to balance itself out, zoning laws aren't as flexible. It's a fine line between inconvenient to intolerable, as more and more people living in San Francisco are discovering.

cauterized 10y ago

Because an office in Manhattan gives you access to talent from the entire heavily populated (20 million) and relatively well educated NY metro area. (Which in turn grows because highly educated people are drawn there for employment opportunities. Positive feedback cycle.) An office in SmallTown USA gives you access to the talent of the 10,000 people who live in SmallTown and an additional 10,000 people who live in the vicinity and are willing to drive 30-60 minutes to your office. And anyone who's educated and had a choice has moved to a larger city.

danielweber 10y ago
> And anyone who's educated and had a choice has moved to a larger city. If they've rationally moved to the larger city, I don't see why anyone should cater to their problems. You can't have it both ways, where people are rationally moving to cities but also surprisingly victimized by cruel city commute times. Also, there is also plenty of room between SmallTown and New York City. It's a strawman to think the alternate to to Manhattan is a town of 10,000.
- cauterized 10y ago
  Sure there's in between sizes, but the population willing to commute to a suburb of NYC is also small relative to the city proper; as is the population available to a mid-size city (which may have commute time problems of its own and doesn't have the employment draw of the hugest cities). And people may both move irrationally in search of employment and move rationally despite huge commute times (if the greater chance at a higher income outweighs the commute time for you). Or you may move based on rational principles but incorrect premises about how long you'll have to commute. Or move despite a long commute with the expectation that working in the city will give you chances to advance in your career and soon be able to afford a shorter commute.