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> Nothing boils my blood more than someone referring to all short term loans as "payday loans". Lendup is a fantastic company offering completely reasonable loa

> Nothing boils my blood more than someone referring to all short term loans as "payday loans". Lendup is a fantastic company offering completely reasonable loans to customers with a strong need. LendUp is nothing of the sort. They're not at all different from a Payday Loan service, they just have better PR. Don't be so naive that you can't see past that even as far as to look at the rates at which they are lending.

tommynicholas 10y ago
Not naive, thanks for the advice though!
askldfhjkasfhd 10y ago
I disagree with your statement that they are not at all different from a payday loan service. Payday loan services' model is to roll over debt so you can never escape needing them. LendUp pretty clearly has a program in place (their "Ladder") that tries to help people get access to cheaper loans once they prove themselves creditworthy. And LU seems to genuinely want their customers to get fluent in money-talk so they can build their credit. I do see your point: from the outside, based entirely on the incontrovertible, objective facts (who they loan to, what rates they charge), they seem no different. However, I feel like their intention, their path, is one that will try to help people. It's the opposite of predatory, even if they do resemble their doppleganger mindset.
- tommynicholas 10y ago
  They probably fit the technical definition of a "payday loan" but that's exactly my point - everyone has decided that anything that meets the categorical definition of a "payday loan" is inherently bad, no matter whether it is or not. The TRUTH is "predatory payday loans" and "payday loans" are different. People NEED payday loans, and we need to stop lenders from praying on that need. Lendup is doing it so, so right. Proud of that team every day!
  - askldfhjkasfhd 10y ago
    Yes, I agree with what you said. Thank you for putting it so concisely: the proprietor's intent does matter in how I view a company. Good intent does not necessarily mean beneficence, but it should be noted when the owner's have good versus bad intent.
  - devishard 10y ago
    I'm not arguing against LendUp because they fit a definition, I'm arguing against them because they profit by taking money from poor people. People don't need payday loans, they need actual help, help that doesn't leave them worse off in the long term.
- devishard 10y ago
  Given that their intentions result in the same loans as every other payday loan service, I'm not sure why we should care about their intentions even if we trust them (I don't). The "Ladder" is an insult to the poor and to your intelligence. Poor people don't need loans at any rate, they need housing assistance, food stamps, and education/training to get better jobs. If you're giving an already poor person short-term income at a greater long-term cost, you aren't helping anyone but yourself. There isn't an ethical way to take money from the poor.

tommynicholas 10y ago

Not naive, thanks for the advice though!

askldfhjkasfhd 10y ago

I disagree with your statement that they are not at all different from a payday loan service. Payday loan services' model is to roll over debt so you can never escape needing them. LendUp pretty clearly has a program in place (their "Ladder") that tries to help people get access to cheaper loans once they prove themselves creditworthy. And LU seems to genuinely want their customers to get fluent in money-talk so they can build their credit. I do see your point: from the outside, based entirely on the incontrovertible, objective facts (who they loan to, what rates they charge), they seem no different. However, I feel like their intention, their path, is one that will try to help people. It's the opposite of predatory, even if they do resemble their doppleganger mindset.

tommynicholas 10y ago
They probably fit the technical definition of a "payday loan" but that's exactly my point - everyone has decided that anything that meets the categorical definition of a "payday loan" is inherently bad, no matter whether it is or not. The TRUTH is "predatory payday loans" and "payday loans" are different. People NEED payday loans, and we need to stop lenders from praying on that need. Lendup is doing it so, so right. Proud of that team every day!
- askldfhjkasfhd 10y ago
  Yes, I agree with what you said. Thank you for putting it so concisely: the proprietor's intent does matter in how I view a company. Good intent does not necessarily mean beneficence, but it should be noted when the owner's have good versus bad intent.
- devishard 10y ago
  I'm not arguing against LendUp because they fit a definition, I'm arguing against them because they profit by taking money from poor people. People don't need payday loans, they need actual help, help that doesn't leave them worse off in the long term.
devishard 10y ago
Given that their intentions result in the same loans as every other payday loan service, I'm not sure why we should care about their intentions even if we trust them (I don't). The "Ladder" is an insult to the poor and to your intelligence. Poor people don't need loans at any rate, they need housing assistance, food stamps, and education/training to get better jobs. If you're giving an already poor person short-term income at a greater long-term cost, you aren't helping anyone but yourself. There isn't an ethical way to take money from the poor.