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I was following along when I came to the German list. I highly doubt that any German would describe the ethnicities in German society along that list, but stil
by rsibue 17y ago
I was following along when I came to the German list.
I highly doubt that any German would describe the ethnicities in German society along that list, but still there was some truth in it (mention of Turkish and Balkanic immigration.)
Then I came upon the French list, and I spilled tea on my keyboard ! (I'm French.)
The CIA list apparently describes historical successive waves of immigration, which is definitely not how people in the French society would describe their ethnicity/identity. (And it's probably wrong in the same way for almost all other societies.)
This doesn't even take into account the fact that the French political culture actively discourages thinking one's identity in terms of ethnicity, and that many French people (of all ethnicities) would find any mention of ethnicity distasteful.
Particularly laughable in the French case is the "Celtic and Latin with Teutonic" label.
The lesson is simple : when localising, get local help. Ideally from several people, all of whom should both know their own society well, but also have extensive foreign experience (it helps because everyone has blind spots regarding his own society)
- deleted 17y ago[deleted]
- ugh 17y agoYou would probably ask for country of birth in Germany. I’ve seen that, I have never seen any questions about ethnicity. (Germany is of course relatively homogenous.)
- wheels 17y agoThe list is sort of accurate for Germany, and the point still carries. In Germany, the notion of ethnicity typically gets munged into nationality even when it really means ethnicity. Specifically, "Ausländer" (literally, "foreigner") is typically applied to someone not ethnically north-west European, even if born in Germany, though not typically to someone like myself (an American of north-west European stock). A Russian, or Pole, however, which to American eyes would just appear to be another flavor of pasty white, will often be noted as a separate group. Part of that is codified in German nationality law which is still based in jus sanguinis, based on "blood", in contrast with jus soil which is for example used in the US, UK and France. For example, someone with Turkish parents born in Germany must still be naturalized to become a German citizen. What I noticed when first moving to Germany was that the concept of ethnicity independent of nationality scarcely exists, throwing yet another curve-ball into a site which is collecting such data. By and large, as another commenter noted, Germany is fairly homogenous, however in cities things do get mixed up quite a bit. Specifically in my part of Berlin (Kreuzberg) there's a lot of variance. (Probably the the neighborhood in Germany with the lowest percentage of ethnic Germans.)
- wheels 17y agoI decided to look this up and it appears that the law changed in 2000. Someone born in Germany with a parent that is a permanent resident and has lived in Germany for more than 8 years does have automatic German citizenship: http://www.bundesregierung.de/Webs/Breg/DE/Bundesregierung/BeauftragtefuerIntegration/Einbuergerung/Geburtsortsprinzip/geburtsortsprinzip.html http://www.bundesregierung.de/Webs/Breg/DE/Bundesregierung/B... (in German)