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> It's only in the cases of things going spectacularly wrong that being in the hospital helps. Yep. My wife had a perfectly normal pregnancy, and everything w

> It's only in the cases of things going spectacularly wrong that being in the hospital helps. Yep. My wife had a perfectly normal pregnancy, and everything went perfectly until something went spectacularly wrong. When my daughter was born, and didn't breath on her own for the first 3 minutes. If she hadn't been in a hospital, it would have gone down as still born. She was in the hospital, immediately received resuscitation and numerous other treatments which maintained her blood oxygen level sufficient to prevent brain damage, and now at the age of 4 is ahead of every developmental measure. "It's only in the case of things going spectacularly wrong" that any risk mitigation activity actually provides value, and in every other case is essentially worthless. YMMV, but I tell everyone I can the story of my daughter whenever they talk about home birth.

Arnt 10y ago
I agree with the larger sentiment, but don't be so quick, it's a game of chance even when shit happens. One of my daughters too didn't breathe when she was born. The midwives grew very very ernest very very quickly, and the little child was rushed off to hospital in an ambulance. All went fine. I was a little shaky that first night.
- ygjb-dupe 10y ago
  Life is a game of chance, but we make our own luck (beyond what we are born with) by making sensible decisions, taking measured chances, and knowing when to admit we are out of our depth. Yes, midwives (in some jurisdictions) are trained, qualified practitioners. That said, they are not equipped to deal with many, many complications other than by calling an ambulance and hoping for the best. Choosing to have my daughter born in a hospital instead of a home birth was most likely the difference between having a healthy baby girl and something in the range of severe mental handicap to stillbirth. Having a child is a huge risk and investment (by every measure, emotionally, financially, socially, economically, etc). Why would you risk having a stillborn child, life with a mentally or physically handicapped child (this is not a shot against handicapped children - it's a shot against people who refuse to apply critical thinking skills to emotionally charged high risk decisions) so that you can satisfy some foolish ideal that being born at home is better than being born around people who have trained for much of their adult lives to keep your kid alive in its first few days? It ranks right up there with the foolish parents who refuse to vaccinate children against common ailments or choose naturopathy or homeopathy because of "toxic western medicine".
  - stcredzero 10y ago
    Not really. Watch the Healthcare Triage video. The odds kind of wash out. You're very highly emotionally affected by your own anecdotal case, but that would be a particularly potent example of Survivor Bias.
  - gohrt 10y ago
    Don't confuse midwifery with home-birth. They are overlapping but different. There are midwife delivery centers that are attached to hospitals.
    - ygjb-dupe 10y ago
      I didn't; I acknowledged that in some jurisdictions midwives are well regulated. I also contrasted hospital birth with home birth.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
- brianpgordon 10y ago
  Unfortunately I can't seem to find it but I read a story recently about a couple who lost their newborn during a home birth. The twist was that they were minutes away from a top NICU with an ambulance standing by. They were told that if they had given birth in the hospital, their child would have lived. The father was basically saying that the reassurance of having an ambulance standing by is illusory and if something goes wrong you want to be inside the hospital, not an ambulance ride away.
  - gohrt 10y ago
    > They were told by whom? That's an easy claim to make if you don't have to test it.
serge2k 10y ago
The woman in the article needed a C-section because of emergency as well. Just doesn't seem worth the risk to me.
lsaferite 10y ago
This is exactly what happened with our daughter. She had severe MAS at birth and was not breathing. It took a team of 4 working on her non-stop to keep her alive. After several hours of this they had to medivac her to another hospital that could do ECMO. She promptly went on life support and 11 days later, after her lungs were functional, she was able to come off the ECMO machine. Today she's a happy and super smart 3-year old. I have zero doubt that a home birth would have resulted in either death or severe mental impairment do to oxygen deprivation. I also tell every person I can about my daughter. I understand the desire of home birth, but not availing yourself of available modern emergency medical facilities during child birth is horribly irresponsible. EDIT: And for the record, there was zero prior indication that something was wrong. The first sign was when the water broke and was green.
burfog 10y ago
Every midwife I've known has oxygen and at least one assistant. What do you think the oxygen is for? (not that it gets used much -- your case is far from the norm -- but they DO actually come prepared)
- scott_s 10y ago
  Having oxygen on hand is not the same as being a doctor or nurse, specifically trained to handle such problems.
squidbot 10y ago
I'm curious, in my region (greater Seattle area) almost all the hospitals have birthing centers that are attached to the hospital, but aren't "the hospital." They are nicely appointed rooms with birthing beds, baths, exercise balls, bars etc. They have hidden doors that can "transform" the room in to a hospital room at a moments notice, and if needed the NICU is down the hall. We needed the NICU once, so I was glad for the option. Is this not commonplace in the larger hospital markets (where I would assume most HN'ers live)?

Arnt 10y ago

I agree with the larger sentiment, but don't be so quick, it's a game of chance even when shit happens. One of my daughters too didn't breathe when she was born. The midwives grew very very ernest very very quickly, and the little child was rushed off to hospital in an ambulance. All went fine. I was a little shaky that first night.

ygjb-dupe 10y ago
Life is a game of chance, but we make our own luck (beyond what we are born with) by making sensible decisions, taking measured chances, and knowing when to admit we are out of our depth. Yes, midwives (in some jurisdictions) are trained, qualified practitioners. That said, they are not equipped to deal with many, many complications other than by calling an ambulance and hoping for the best. Choosing to have my daughter born in a hospital instead of a home birth was most likely the difference between having a healthy baby girl and something in the range of severe mental handicap to stillbirth. Having a child is a huge risk and investment (by every measure, emotionally, financially, socially, economically, etc). Why would you risk having a stillborn child, life with a mentally or physically handicapped child (this is not a shot against handicapped children - it's a shot against people who refuse to apply critical thinking skills to emotionally charged high risk decisions) so that you can satisfy some foolish ideal that being born at home is better than being born around people who have trained for much of their adult lives to keep your kid alive in its first few days? It ranks right up there with the foolish parents who refuse to vaccinate children against common ailments or choose naturopathy or homeopathy because of "toxic western medicine".
- stcredzero 10y ago
  Not really. Watch the Healthcare Triage video. The odds kind of wash out. You're very highly emotionally affected by your own anecdotal case, but that would be a particularly potent example of Survivor Bias.
- gohrt 10y ago
  Don't confuse midwifery with home-birth. They are overlapping but different. There are midwife delivery centers that are attached to hospitals.
  - ygjb-dupe 10y ago
    I didn't; I acknowledged that in some jurisdictions midwives are well regulated. I also contrasted hospital birth with home birth.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
brianpgordon 10y ago
Unfortunately I can't seem to find it but I read a story recently about a couple who lost their newborn during a home birth. The twist was that they were minutes away from a top NICU with an ambulance standing by. They were told that if they had given birth in the hospital, their child would have lived. The father was basically saying that the reassurance of having an ambulance standing by is illusory and if something goes wrong you want to be inside the hospital, not an ambulance ride away.
- gohrt 10y ago
  > They were told by whom? That's an easy claim to make if you don't have to test it.

serge2k 10y ago

The woman in the article needed a C-section because of emergency as well. Just doesn't seem worth the risk to me.

lsaferite 10y ago

This is exactly what happened with our daughter. She had severe MAS at birth and was not breathing. It took a team of 4 working on her non-stop to keep her alive. After several hours of this they had to medivac her to another hospital that could do ECMO. She promptly went on life support and 11 days later, after her lungs were functional, she was able to come off the ECMO machine. Today she's a happy and super smart 3-year old. I have zero doubt that a home birth would have resulted in either death or severe mental impairment do to oxygen deprivation. I also tell every person I can about my daughter. I understand the desire of home birth, but not availing yourself of available modern emergency medical facilities during child birth is horribly irresponsible. EDIT: And for the record, there was zero prior indication that something was wrong. The first sign was when the water broke and was green.

burfog 10y ago

Every midwife I've known has oxygen and at least one assistant. What do you think the oxygen is for? (not that it gets used much -- your case is far from the norm -- but they DO actually come prepared)

scott_s 10y ago
Having oxygen on hand is not the same as being a doctor or nurse, specifically trained to handle such problems.

squidbot 10y ago

I'm curious, in my region (greater Seattle area) almost all the hospitals have birthing centers that are attached to the hospital, but aren't "the hospital." They are nicely appointed rooms with birthing beds, baths, exercise balls, bars etc. They have hidden doors that can "transform" the room in to a hospital room at a moments notice, and if needed the NICU is down the hall. We needed the NICU once, so I was glad for the option. Is this not commonplace in the larger hospital markets (where I would assume most HN'ers live)?