4 ms·

Governor Vetoes Bill Requiring Procurement Consultants to Register as Lobbyists

32 points by us0r 10y ago

JoshTriplett 10y ago
The title on HN is blatantly editorialized. The actual article title: "Governor Vetoes Bill Requiring Procurement Consultants to Register as Lobbyists".
- blazespin 10y ago
  I disagree. Editorialized implies opinion. I don't think the fact that the bill is "transparency legislation" is an opinion. I think everyone agrees that's exactly what it's for. Whether it achieves it, is another question, and might worthy of a veto because it does not. But that's what it's trying to achieve.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
  - argonaut 10y ago
    Even if that was true, it is opinion that picks which "facts" to put in the title. If the title was "Governor Vetoes Bill That Would Have Cost State $1.3 Million," that would also be factual, but it is quite blatantly editorialized. > Whether it achieves it, is another question If a bill doesn't achieve transparency, then it isn't a piece of transparency legislation. It's a piece that someone claims to be transparency legislation, and that others disagree about, making it a matter of opinion.
    - r00fus 10y ago
      Just because "some people" don't think a fact to be true, doesn't mean it's a matter of opinion. This is a case of argument to moderation [1] - presenting dissenting opinions to factual evidence doesn't mean the "truth is somewhere in-between". Example: Obama presents birth certificate, but "some people" (notably the current GOP frontrunner/nominee) dispute this. The reality is not somewhere in the middle... one side has facts. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_to_moderation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_to_moderation
      - argonaut 10y ago
        Sure, but none of that refutes my point. All you've done is point out a logical fallacy in a side comment I made, my argument didn't rely on the side comment. If the bill does not in fact achieve, or cannot be proved to achieve, more transparency, then saying it promotes transparency is opinion. And my point about the mere selective choice of words in a headline being subjective still stands.
  - mmanfrin 10y ago
    Yes, the notion that the bill is "transparency legislation" is in fact an opinion, as can be gleaned from the fact that the article title is different from that of the linked article -- the original poster has editorialized.
  - eva1984 10y ago
    It is no doubt an interpretation of the legislation's purpose, thus an opinion.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- dang 10y ago
  Yes. Submitters: please don't rewrite titles unless they are misleading or linkbait. That's in the site guidelines: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html (Submitted title was 'California Governor Vetoes Transprency Legislation'.)
tyre 10y ago
These conflicts of interest are rampant. Here is a recent example from San Diego by a company called Accela: Another hopeful using [lobbying company] Presidio’s services is Accela, which wants to get a “contract for IT support services within the Development Services Department.” Whether by coincidence or not, John Sasson of Orinda, California, who is listed as working in “business development” for Accela, kicked in $1050 for [San Diego Mayor] Faulconer’s reelection campaign on March 17, according to a March 18 disclosure report. Maybe Mr. Sasson is deeply interested in San Diego politics, despite living 500 miles away. http://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2016/mar/30/radar-beer-money-influence-accela/ http://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2016/mar/30/radar-beer-mo...
- cstejerean 10y ago
  So anyone can get government contracts by contributing $1000 towards a mayoral reelection campaign? Seems really cheap.
  - seanp2k2 10y ago
    Buying political influence is generally a great deal. It should be taxed at 90% or so IMO.
JumpCrisscross 10y ago
> In March, the Fair Political Practices Commission (FPPC) voted to oppose the bill and sent a letter to lawmakers urging them to reject it, raising concerns that it would expand the commission’s mission to a “highly specialized area” of state contracts best overseen by the Department of General Services, the Department of Technology and other state agencies. Is the bill being vetoed to be re-worked, or is this an excuse to kill it?
- nickff 10y ago
  It is usually hard to know what the real reason is in this type of situation. Politicians will say they are veto-ing to allow for a rework when they are really just killing it.
benberkowitz 10y ago
At SeeClickFix we have a policy that board members and officers may not contribute to political campaigns for this reason. Wrote this post about why a while back: http://benjaminberkowitz.blogspot.com/2013/09/donations-by-government-contractors-and.html?m=1 http://benjaminberkowitz.blogspot.com/2013/09/donations-by-g...

32 points by us0r 10y ago

The title on HN is blatantly editorialized. The actual article title: "Governor Vetoes Bill Requiring Procurement Consultants to Register as Lobbyists".

blazespin 10y ago
I disagree. Editorialized implies opinion. I don't think the fact that the bill is "transparency legislation" is an opinion. I think everyone agrees that's exactly what it's for. Whether it achieves it, is another question, and might worthy of a veto because it does not. But that's what it's trying to achieve.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- argonaut 10y ago
  Even if that was true, it is opinion that picks which "facts" to put in the title. If the title was "Governor Vetoes Bill That Would Have Cost State $1.3 Million," that would also be factual, but it is quite blatantly editorialized. > Whether it achieves it, is another question If a bill doesn't achieve transparency, then it isn't a piece of transparency legislation. It's a piece that someone claims to be transparency legislation, and that others disagree about, making it a matter of opinion.
  - r00fus 10y ago
    Just because "some people" don't think a fact to be true, doesn't mean it's a matter of opinion. This is a case of argument to moderation [1] - presenting dissenting opinions to factual evidence doesn't mean the "truth is somewhere in-between". Example: Obama presents birth certificate, but "some people" (notably the current GOP frontrunner/nominee) dispute this. The reality is not somewhere in the middle... one side has facts. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_to_moderation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_to_moderation
    - argonaut 10y ago
      Sure, but none of that refutes my point. All you've done is point out a logical fallacy in a side comment I made, my argument didn't rely on the side comment. If the bill does not in fact achieve, or cannot be proved to achieve, more transparency, then saying it promotes transparency is opinion. And my point about the mere selective choice of words in a headline being subjective still stands.
- mmanfrin 10y ago
  Yes, the notion that the bill is "transparency legislation" is in fact an opinion, as can be gleaned from the fact that the article title is different from that of the linked article -- the original poster has editorialized.
- eva1984 10y ago
  It is no doubt an interpretation of the legislation's purpose, thus an opinion.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
dang 10y ago
Yes. Submitters: please don't rewrite titles unless they are misleading or linkbait. That's in the site guidelines: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html (Submitted title was 'California Governor Vetoes Transprency Legislation'.)

tyre 10y ago

These conflicts of interest are rampant. Here is a recent example from San Diego by a company called Accela: Another hopeful using [lobbying company] Presidio’s services is Accela, which wants to get a “contract for IT support services within the Development Services Department.” Whether by coincidence or not, John Sasson of Orinda, California, who is listed as working in “business development” for Accela, kicked in $1050 for [San Diego Mayor] Faulconer’s reelection campaign on March 17, according to a March 18 disclosure report. Maybe Mr. Sasson is deeply interested in San Diego politics, despite living 500 miles away. http://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2016/mar/30/radar-beer-money-influence-accela/ http://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2016/mar/30/radar-beer-mo...

cstejerean 10y ago
So anyone can get government contracts by contributing $1000 towards a mayoral reelection campaign? Seems really cheap.
- seanp2k2 10y ago
  Buying political influence is generally a great deal. It should be taxed at 90% or so IMO.

JumpCrisscross 10y ago

> In March, the Fair Political Practices Commission (FPPC) voted to oppose the bill and sent a letter to lawmakers urging them to reject it, raising concerns that it would expand the commission’s mission to a “highly specialized area” of state contracts best overseen by the Department of General Services, the Department of Technology and other state agencies. Is the bill being vetoed to be re-worked, or is this an excuse to kill it?

nickff 10y ago
It is usually hard to know what the real reason is in this type of situation. Politicians will say they are veto-ing to allow for a rework when they are really just killing it.

benberkowitz 10y ago

At SeeClickFix we have a policy that board members and officers may not contribute to political campaigns for this reason. Wrote this post about why a while back: http://benjaminberkowitz.blogspot.com/2013/09/donations-by-government-contractors-and.html?m=1 http://benjaminberkowitz.blogspot.com/2013/09/donations-by-g...