6 ms·

This happened with Cadillac and they've been spending a lot of money to appeal to a younger demo.

ethanbond 10y ago
No, it didn't. Cadillac didn't suddenly become unappealing to young people just because old people like them. They became unappealing because they were simply unappealing to young people and there were more appealing options for young people. Android has yet to produce anything that even remotely resembles a more appealing option to these demographics. Apple is an expert in "hip." If you have an Android and your friend has an iPhone, you know that your messages are showing up green whereas everyone else's are showing up blue. This lack of totally 100% superficial conformity alone means that Android has a monstrous hill to climb with younger people, e.g. the people who care most deeply about acceptance amongst peers.
- exclusiv 10y ago
  Yes - branding drives perception which can drive consumer decisions. Consumers can also drive a brand. Certainly skewing old wasn't the only factor for Cadillac but it definitely was a component and they are trying to spend their way out of that image (both with ads and with more performance-minded cars). I agree that Apple is an expert at hip but their time dominating is limited. It gets harder to be hip when so many people, especially those much older have them and mom/dad/grandma/grandpa all want to Facetime you. Younger people have been migrating their time away from Facebook because of the saturation. I disagree on Android and the data doesn't back up your statements. Android is comparable with younger demos [3] and has more market share [1] (esp. outside the US) [2] so they don't "have a monstrous hill" to climb with younger people. Android and device manufacturers are positioned quite well. It's going to be a challenge for Apple to continue to ask for a premium price when they no longer have a compelling quality argument and Android OS and devices keep getting better with many outperforming the iPhone. People are also getting tired of Apple's closed systems. They are "The Man" but most consumers haven't realized it yet. The squeezing they do with storage is ridiculous. [1] 52.8% market share in the US, Jan 2016 - https://www.comscore.com/Insights/Rankings/comScore-Reports-January-2016-US-Smartphone-Subscriber-Market-Share https://www.comscore.com/Insights/Rankings/comScore-Reports-... [2] 80.7% market share globally, 4Q2015 - http://www.gartner.com/newsroom/id/3215217 http://www.gartner.com/newsroom/id/3215217 [3] 52% of millenials have an Android device vs 44% for iPhone, 2014 - http://www.techtimes.com/articles/15084/20140908/draft-android-reigns-over-ios-millennials.htm http://www.techtimes.com/articles/15084/20140908/draft-andro...
  - ethanbond 10y ago
    > Younger people have been migrating their time away from Facebook because of the saturation. Therefore Apple is becoming uncool? Kids are moving away from Facebook not because old people are using it and that makes it uncool. It's because old people are using it and that means old people are watching them with it. Facebook is also just getting worse and worse as a product, while things like Snapchat are getting better and don't have parents/employers looking over your shoulder. Re: Android, these are the same arguments we've seen since Android first started getting market share, yet Apple is still chugging along just fine. Market share is only one part of the story, and it's so far from an accurate indicator of "in" factor (exclusive things are often "in") OR of product health/profitability. "People" are getting tired of closed systems? Which people? FOSS advocates? Hackers and tinkerers? Thank god there are 100x more people with equivalent checkbooks and less idealism when it comes to which devices they purchase.
TwiztidK 10y ago
That's really an issue with most luxury car brands, they become associated with old people because that group can more readily afford them. A $600 phone is attainable by most age groups, so I really don't see the same thing happening.
tim333 10y ago
It's more Cadillac became seen as an old person's car. That hasn't happened to the iPhone.
- dragonwriter 10y ago
  It hasn't happened yet, perhaps, but the demographic information I've seen (which, admittedly, is from 2013 and may have changed) shows the iPhone-to-Android ratio monotonically increasing with age, which certainly suggests a risk for that: http://www.marketingprofs.com/charts/2013/10957/how-iphone-and-android-ownership-varies-by-demographic http://www.marketingprofs.com/charts/2013/10957/how-iphone-a...
  - vitd 10y ago
    Keep in mind, too, that parents may not want to spend very much on a cell phone for a kid who's likely to drop it, lose it, etc. It may just be that the higher price makes it less likely a younger person will have one.
    - exclusiv 10y ago
      That data and others I've seen doesn't include < 18. In my experience I've only seen kids with iPhones, often the previous generation from their parents. iOS seems to have better kids content and iPads and iPhones are quite durable from drop with protection.
ska 10y ago
I think it was far more complicated than that. Cadillac was a luxury brand that completely lost the plot, in terms of quality, service and importantly: brand. As a result, luxury customers went elsewhere almost entirely (hello German sedans) and it stopped being an aspirational brand. With younger buyers mostly not interested, most of success was selling to older customers for whom the brand still had left over positive associations, plus some die hard "no foreign cars" types. But this just made the brand problem worse, cementing the "old person car" brand. So yes, they're fighting it now (without much success). But the real problem was that they started to peddle bad cars, and competitors ate their lunch. This in no way resembles the current situation with iPhone.

No, it didn't. Cadillac didn't suddenly become unappealing to young people just because old people like them. They became unappealing because they were simply unappealing to young people and there were more appealing options for young people. Android has yet to produce anything that even remotely resembles a more appealing option to these demographics. Apple is an expert in "hip." If you have an Android and your friend has an iPhone, you know that your messages are showing up green whereas everyone else's are showing up blue. This lack of totally 100% superficial conformity alone means that Android has a monstrous hill to climb with younger people, e.g. the people who care most deeply about acceptance amongst peers.

exclusiv 10y ago
Yes - branding drives perception which can drive consumer decisions. Consumers can also drive a brand. Certainly skewing old wasn't the only factor for Cadillac but it definitely was a component and they are trying to spend their way out of that image (both with ads and with more performance-minded cars). I agree that Apple is an expert at hip but their time dominating is limited. It gets harder to be hip when so many people, especially those much older have them and mom/dad/grandma/grandpa all want to Facetime you. Younger people have been migrating their time away from Facebook because of the saturation. I disagree on Android and the data doesn't back up your statements. Android is comparable with younger demos [3] and has more market share [1] (esp. outside the US) [2] so they don't "have a monstrous hill" to climb with younger people. Android and device manufacturers are positioned quite well. It's going to be a challenge for Apple to continue to ask for a premium price when they no longer have a compelling quality argument and Android OS and devices keep getting better with many outperforming the iPhone. People are also getting tired of Apple's closed systems. They are "The Man" but most consumers haven't realized it yet. The squeezing they do with storage is ridiculous. [1] 52.8% market share in the US, Jan 2016 - https://www.comscore.com/Insights/Rankings/comScore-Reports-January-2016-US-Smartphone-Subscriber-Market-Share https://www.comscore.com/Insights/Rankings/comScore-Reports-... [2] 80.7% market share globally, 4Q2015 - http://www.gartner.com/newsroom/id/3215217 http://www.gartner.com/newsroom/id/3215217 [3] 52% of millenials have an Android device vs 44% for iPhone, 2014 - http://www.techtimes.com/articles/15084/20140908/draft-android-reigns-over-ios-millennials.htm http://www.techtimes.com/articles/15084/20140908/draft-andro...
- ethanbond 10y ago
  > Younger people have been migrating their time away from Facebook because of the saturation. Therefore Apple is becoming uncool? Kids are moving away from Facebook not because old people are using it and that makes it uncool. It's because old people are using it and that means old people are watching them with it. Facebook is also just getting worse and worse as a product, while things like Snapchat are getting better and don't have parents/employers looking over your shoulder. Re: Android, these are the same arguments we've seen since Android first started getting market share, yet Apple is still chugging along just fine. Market share is only one part of the story, and it's so far from an accurate indicator of "in" factor (exclusive things are often "in") OR of product health/profitability. "People" are getting tired of closed systems? Which people? FOSS advocates? Hackers and tinkerers? Thank god there are 100x more people with equivalent checkbooks and less idealism when it comes to which devices they purchase.

TwiztidK 10y ago

That's really an issue with most luxury car brands, they become associated with old people because that group can more readily afford them. A $600 phone is attainable by most age groups, so I really don't see the same thing happening.

tim333 10y ago

It's more Cadillac became seen as an old person's car. That hasn't happened to the iPhone.

dragonwriter 10y ago
It hasn't happened yet, perhaps, but the demographic information I've seen (which, admittedly, is from 2013 and may have changed) shows the iPhone-to-Android ratio monotonically increasing with age, which certainly suggests a risk for that: http://www.marketingprofs.com/charts/2013/10957/how-iphone-and-android-ownership-varies-by-demographic http://www.marketingprofs.com/charts/2013/10957/how-iphone-a...
- vitd 10y ago
  Keep in mind, too, that parents may not want to spend very much on a cell phone for a kid who's likely to drop it, lose it, etc. It may just be that the higher price makes it less likely a younger person will have one.
  - exclusiv 10y ago
    That data and others I've seen doesn't include < 18. In my experience I've only seen kids with iPhones, often the previous generation from their parents. iOS seems to have better kids content and iPads and iPhones are quite durable from drop with protection.

ska 10y ago

I think it was far more complicated than that. Cadillac was a luxury brand that completely lost the plot, in terms of quality, service and importantly: brand. As a result, luxury customers went elsewhere almost entirely (hello German sedans) and it stopped being an aspirational brand. With younger buyers mostly not interested, most of success was selling to older customers for whom the brand still had left over positive associations, plus some die hard "no foreign cars" types. But this just made the brand problem worse, cementing the "old person car" brand. So yes, they're fighting it now (without much success). But the real problem was that they started to peddle bad cars, and competitors ate their lunch. This in no way resembles the current situation with iPhone.