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You can't have an expectation of privacy in public places. Facial recognition can be beat by a hat + sunglasses (which is the hugest plot hole in Person of Int

You can't have an expectation of privacy in public places. Facial recognition can be beat by a hat + sunglasses (which is the hugest plot hole in Person of Interest, the characters never even attempt to disguise themselves).

maxxxxx 10y ago
I don't want to live in a world where I have to wear a hat + sunglasses.
- imaginenore 10y ago
  You don't have to. But throwing a tantrum isn't going to change reality. We have the laws allowing anybody to film anything visible from public places, with a few security exceptions. That's more important than you getting upset that you are not invisible.
  - alayne 10y ago
    We're talking about limiting the actions of government here. It's hardly a "tantrum".
- marincounty 10y ago
  I think it's a good idea to get used to wearing sunglasses. This next paragraph is a bit offtopic, but I think we will look back with regret at how free we were with our picture being taken. Right now--I don't think it's acceptable behavior to be clicking away. It used to be cute, now it's just teenage behavior. To the Shutterbug who can't go anywhere without taking your pictures--at at least don't automatically post? Or, maybe put the camera/phone in your pocket? Enjoy the moment? Or, at least let the people around you enjoy the moment? If anyone cares the microphone in the courthouse light was for these realeste investors whom were rigging foreclosures in Alameda, San Mateo, etc. They were paying other buyers to not bid on foreclosures. I always felt not enough people show up at these auctions. Just don't violate The Sherman Anti-trust Act. https://www.fbi.gov/sanfrancisco/press-releases/2015/two-northern-california-real-estate-investors-plead-guilty-to-bid-rigging-and-fraud-at-public-foreclosure-auctions https://www.fbi.gov/sanfrancisco/press-releases/2015/two-nor...
EFruit 10y ago
It's not a plot hole if the magical artificially-intelligent supercomputer also integrates gait detection and real-time location data.
bitL 10y ago
Your walking style identifies you better than face. Are you going to walk differently once you put a hat and sunglasses on?
- imaginenore 10y ago
  Do you have a database of walking styles? Does anybody? They definitely have access to most people's photos - driver's licenses, passports. I personally don't care if they know where I go in public. They can just tail me if they really want to know.
  - gopalv 10y ago
    > Do you have a database of walking styles? Does anybody? I nearly always walk around with a 3-d accelerometer which can indeed "phone" home. Here's the ML extraction mechanism as explained by a Samsung engineer - http://www.slideshare.net/satnam74/the-fifth-elephant-2013-talk-smart-ana/8 http://www.slideshare.net/satnam74/the-fifth-elephant-2013-t...
    - imaginenore 10y ago
      Yeah but if they have access to your phone, they already know where you are, no need for the overcomplicated accelerometer method.
      - darpa_escapee 10y ago
        If it's in a database, then people without access to your phone can still identify you.
- RadioAndrea 10y ago
  In Cory Doctorow's book Little Brother, the protagonist defeats gait sensors with some pebbles in his shoe. It's really not such a bad idea, as every step is going to be different as your foot tries not to hit the pebble too hard.
- deleted 10y ago
smsm42 10y ago
If you followed PoI closely enough (if you did not: spoiler alert!), the main characters do not have to disguise themselves from Samaritan because they snuck in a patch that literally makes Samaritan blind when it sees them. For one reason or another, Samaritan or its accomplices can not locate and remove that patch. That, of course, does not prevent Samaritan from figuring out where they are by other means (like tracking their actions, accomplices, vehicles, etc.) and from Samaritan agents to see them in plain old ways. But by the time a team of dozen commandos comes in guns blazing, it's too late to get the hat on. They would probably disregard the hat.
scrollaway 10y ago
To address your point on Person of Interest (an absolutely wonderful series, recommended to the entire HN audience): There's several instances where the main characters disguise themselves. But it's not practical for general purpose - There is more than facial recognition at play - voice recognition, process of elimination etc and there is no trouble tracking already-identified targets.
darpa_escapee 10y ago
You can be identified by body shape and gait. If you've ever been through airport security, a 3D model of your body has been captured. If you have a smartphone, your gait can be recorded.

maxxxxx 10y ago

I don't want to live in a world where I have to wear a hat + sunglasses.

imaginenore 10y ago
You don't have to. But throwing a tantrum isn't going to change reality. We have the laws allowing anybody to film anything visible from public places, with a few security exceptions. That's more important than you getting upset that you are not invisible.
- alayne 10y ago
  We're talking about limiting the actions of government here. It's hardly a "tantrum".
marincounty 10y ago
I think it's a good idea to get used to wearing sunglasses. This next paragraph is a bit offtopic, but I think we will look back with regret at how free we were with our picture being taken. Right now--I don't think it's acceptable behavior to be clicking away. It used to be cute, now it's just teenage behavior. To the Shutterbug who can't go anywhere without taking your pictures--at at least don't automatically post? Or, maybe put the camera/phone in your pocket? Enjoy the moment? Or, at least let the people around you enjoy the moment? If anyone cares the microphone in the courthouse light was for these realeste investors whom were rigging foreclosures in Alameda, San Mateo, etc. They were paying other buyers to not bid on foreclosures. I always felt not enough people show up at these auctions. Just don't violate The Sherman Anti-trust Act. https://www.fbi.gov/sanfrancisco/press-releases/2015/two-northern-california-real-estate-investors-plead-guilty-to-bid-rigging-and-fraud-at-public-foreclosure-auctions https://www.fbi.gov/sanfrancisco/press-releases/2015/two-nor...

EFruit 10y ago

It's not a plot hole if the magical artificially-intelligent supercomputer also integrates gait detection and real-time location data.

bitL 10y ago

Your walking style identifies you better than face. Are you going to walk differently once you put a hat and sunglasses on?

imaginenore 10y ago
Do you have a database of walking styles? Does anybody? They definitely have access to most people's photos - driver's licenses, passports. I personally don't care if they know where I go in public. They can just tail me if they really want to know.
- gopalv 10y ago
  > Do you have a database of walking styles? Does anybody? I nearly always walk around with a 3-d accelerometer which can indeed "phone" home. Here's the ML extraction mechanism as explained by a Samsung engineer - http://www.slideshare.net/satnam74/the-fifth-elephant-2013-talk-smart-ana/8 http://www.slideshare.net/satnam74/the-fifth-elephant-2013-t...
  - imaginenore 10y ago
    Yeah but if they have access to your phone, they already know where you are, no need for the overcomplicated accelerometer method.
    - darpa_escapee 10y ago
      If it's in a database, then people without access to your phone can still identify you.
RadioAndrea 10y ago
In Cory Doctorow's book Little Brother, the protagonist defeats gait sensors with some pebbles in his shoe. It's really not such a bad idea, as every step is going to be different as your foot tries not to hit the pebble too hard.
deleted 10y ago

smsm42 10y ago

If you followed PoI closely enough (if you did not: spoiler alert!), the main characters do not have to disguise themselves from Samaritan because they snuck in a patch that literally makes Samaritan blind when it sees them. For one reason or another, Samaritan or its accomplices can not locate and remove that patch. That, of course, does not prevent Samaritan from figuring out where they are by other means (like tracking their actions, accomplices, vehicles, etc.) and from Samaritan agents to see them in plain old ways. But by the time a team of dozen commandos comes in guns blazing, it's too late to get the hat on. They would probably disregard the hat.

scrollaway 10y ago

To address your point on Person of Interest (an absolutely wonderful series, recommended to the entire HN audience): There's several instances where the main characters disguise themselves. But it's not practical for general purpose - There is more than facial recognition at play - voice recognition, process of elimination etc and there is no trouble tracking already-identified targets.

darpa_escapee 10y ago

You can be identified by body shape and gait. If you've ever been through airport security, a 3D model of your body has been captured. If you have a smartphone, your gait can be recorded.