4 ms·

The primary point of hybrids is that the ICE charges the battery. So a charging station isn't even necessary and most hybrids don't have a port for this reason.

by yardie 10y ago

The primary point of hybrids is that the ICE charges the battery. So a charging station isn't even necessary and most hybrids don't have a port for this reason. When energy gets low the ICE fires up to recharge the battery. Most hybrids are decent city drivers. The engine is off for rush hour where stop and go is common. Once on the highway the ICE takes over where its most efficient between 30-90km/h. For the moment, it's a decent compromise.

Bluestrike2 10y ago
The idea behind subsidizing electric cars is to compensate for their higher prices and subsequently increase consumer demand. Including hybrids would undermine that, especially given the relatively low number of options available (less so at under the 60.000€ cap) today. But the German government's goal is to replace inefficient ICE automobiles with more efficient alternatives and not just sell more electric cars. Hybrids, though less desirable than fully electric cars, are still a significant improvement. They're plentiful, available in a number of different models across multiple price points, and available today rather than a few years down the line. From that perspective, including hybrids makes perfect sense.
schiffern 10y ago
This new German program only applies to plug-in hybrids, not hybrids in general.
daveguy 10y ago
This is not the way most hybrids work. Ford, honda and toyota vehicles have power-split or series parallel where the power delivery is some percent electric/gas. In other words most hybrid cars can drive 0 miles on electric only and require some combination of gas and electric power. The series hybrid that you describe is available in the chevy volt and an option on the bmw i3 series. The electric only range of these is 53 (volt) and 81 (i3) miles. These are very much "mostly electric" cars. Most hybrids, in split/parallel mode, are essentially ICE cars, but with significantly improved gas mileage. This significant improvement in gas mileage (going from ~30 mpg to ~50 mpg) is a good reason to include them, but it does mean a half-assed parallel battery power system could be used to game the system. There should probably be some minimum torque delivery or percent power required.
- yardie 10y ago
  I've only ridden in Priuses. They are popular with Parisian taxi drivers. Creeping along at 15-30kph in rush hour traffic the engines rarely came on. It might be different for other hybrids but the Priuses of that vintage (I know the tech gets better each year) can definitely move, for short distances, on battery alone. Definitely agree that hybrids should have some sort of baseline of electric locomotion.
pkulak 10y ago
Eh... not really. Doing that is actually not very efficient because of all the losses you incur going from AC to DC, into the battery, then out of the battery, back to AC and into the motor. The Honda Accord Hybrid, Mitsubishi Outlander and BMW I3 do something like what you describe, but they take the energy straight out of the generator, which still has some losses, but is made up for by the lack of a multi-speed transmission. None of those cars will charge the battery past a bare minimum at stop lights.

by yardie 10y ago

Bluestrike2 10y ago

The idea behind subsidizing electric cars is to compensate for their higher prices and subsequently increase consumer demand. Including hybrids would undermine that, especially given the relatively low number of options available (less so at under the 60.000€ cap) today. But the German government's goal is to replace inefficient ICE automobiles with more efficient alternatives and not just sell more electric cars. Hybrids, though less desirable than fully electric cars, are still a significant improvement. They're plentiful, available in a number of different models across multiple price points, and available today rather than a few years down the line. From that perspective, including hybrids makes perfect sense.

schiffern 10y ago

This new German program only applies to plug-in hybrids, not hybrids in general.

daveguy 10y ago

This is not the way most hybrids work. Ford, honda and toyota vehicles have power-split or series parallel where the power delivery is some percent electric/gas. In other words most hybrid cars can drive 0 miles on electric only and require some combination of gas and electric power. The series hybrid that you describe is available in the chevy volt and an option on the bmw i3 series. The electric only range of these is 53 (volt) and 81 (i3) miles. These are very much "mostly electric" cars. Most hybrids, in split/parallel mode, are essentially ICE cars, but with significantly improved gas mileage. This significant improvement in gas mileage (going from ~30 mpg to ~50 mpg) is a good reason to include them, but it does mean a half-assed parallel battery power system could be used to game the system. There should probably be some minimum torque delivery or percent power required.

yardie 10y ago
I've only ridden in Priuses. They are popular with Parisian taxi drivers. Creeping along at 15-30kph in rush hour traffic the engines rarely came on. It might be different for other hybrids but the Priuses of that vintage (I know the tech gets better each year) can definitely move, for short distances, on battery alone. Definitely agree that hybrids should have some sort of baseline of electric locomotion.

pkulak 10y ago

Eh... not really. Doing that is actually not very efficient because of all the losses you incur going from AC to DC, into the battery, then out of the battery, back to AC and into the motor. The Honda Accord Hybrid, Mitsubishi Outlander and BMW I3 do something like what you describe, but they take the energy straight out of the generator, which still has some losses, but is made up for by the lack of a multi-speed transmission. None of those cars will charge the battery past a bare minimum at stop lights.