5 ms·

Sad news. "They wanted to inspire good service with their tips". It's nice that they want something. I want a pony. Neither of these things happen.

stcredzero 10y ago
"They wanted to inspire good service with their tips" Friends of mine who have been wait staff have unanimously concluded that tips appear random to them. There's no pattern of behavior they can interpret from patrons or which patrons want, other than simple competence.
- wccrawford 10y ago
  I'm sure it appears that way, because there's no way to know what someone would have tipped if you'd done better. If someone does poorly, I give them a baseline tip. Probably 10%, but still 15% if I'm in a good mood anyhow. If they do well, they'll get 20%, up to 30% for really, really good service. But the guy next to me might go from 0% to 10% for awful to great service. There's just no way to know what a tip means.
techthroway443 10y ago
This comment doesn't make sense to me. Neither of these things happen. You are saying tips aren't based on quality of the service?
- toomuchtodo 10y ago
  > That's actually exactly what happens if you are working to get a better tip - percent based on your service. Can you provide a citation? Because all data points to tipping in no way being connected to the service you provide. The best way to receive a tip (based on research)? Be female. Be blonde. Have large breasts. So lets dispense with this nonsense that tipping incentivizes service workers. Its a thinly veiled, widespread (successful) attempt at wage theft. http://www.tippingresearch.com/most_recent_tipping_papers.html http://www.tippingresearch.com/most_recent_tipping_papers.ht... http://freakonomics.com/podcast/should-tipping-be-banned-a-new-freakonomics-radio-podcast/ http://freakonomics.com/podcast/should-tipping-be-banned-a-n... http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/17/abolish-tipping_n_5991796.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/17/abolish-tipping_n_5...
  - techthroway443 10y ago
    > Can you provide a citation? Have you ever eaten out in your life? How many times have you left a 20 percent tip for a waiter who forgot to put in your order, brought the wrong food, was mean to you, etc.
    - toomuchtodo 10y ago
      > How many times have you left a 20 percent tip Always. If I have an issue with the service, I take it up with management. I don't short change someone's wages because of a perceived or actual deficiency. What am I? Some sort of monster? Just because the rest of society is cheap and short changes service workers because they can get away with it (until labor law gets fixed), that does not make it right. And if you say, "I can't afford to tip 20 percent all the time", well then my friend, you can't afford to be eating out. Why do you think its more costly to eat out in Europe than the US? Because staff are paid a living wage there.
      - techthroway443 10y ago
        Sure you can take it up with management but why are you giving extra money to the person who just gave you bad service? Tipping is for the quality of service you receive, and if it's bad service it's absolutely pointless for you to reward that shitty behavior. By all means go ahead but I'm not sure you quite understand the point of tipping in the first place
        oarsinsync 10y ago
        > I'm not sure you quite understand the point of tipping in the first place The point of tipping is to prevent the employer from having to pay a fair wage. Someone who works in such industries depend on tips for their livelihoods. Not performing at 100% resulting in a significant drop in earnings isn't really fair. Given the typical audience on here, a reasonable comparison would be for employers to be docking wages based on time spent not working. Given how many of us visit this site at work, that could be a substantial drop in wages. Then again, you might be making so much money that it doesn't impact you. Servers aren't. They might just be having a bad day. Their mistakes on serving you will have less of an impact on your life than your not tipping them. Most of them are human beings trying to survive. Most of them are not making enough to do more than that.
- readams 10y ago
  The research is clear the the tips have very little to do with quality of service, and much more to do with who the customers are and who the servers are. More, waiters getting low tips tend to think their customers are cheap and not that their service was poor. So when he says that this doesn't happen it's a claim that is well supported by research.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]

stcredzero 10y ago

"They wanted to inspire good service with their tips" Friends of mine who have been wait staff have unanimously concluded that tips appear random to them. There's no pattern of behavior they can interpret from patrons or which patrons want, other than simple competence.

wccrawford 10y ago
I'm sure it appears that way, because there's no way to know what someone would have tipped if you'd done better. If someone does poorly, I give them a baseline tip. Probably 10%, but still 15% if I'm in a good mood anyhow. If they do well, they'll get 20%, up to 30% for really, really good service. But the guy next to me might go from 0% to 10% for awful to great service. There's just no way to know what a tip means.

techthroway443 10y ago

This comment doesn't make sense to me. Neither of these things happen. You are saying tips aren't based on quality of the service?

toomuchtodo 10y ago
> That's actually exactly what happens if you are working to get a better tip - percent based on your service. Can you provide a citation? Because all data points to tipping in no way being connected to the service you provide. The best way to receive a tip (based on research)? Be female. Be blonde. Have large breasts. So lets dispense with this nonsense that tipping incentivizes service workers. Its a thinly veiled, widespread (successful) attempt at wage theft. http://www.tippingresearch.com/most_recent_tipping_papers.html http://www.tippingresearch.com/most_recent_tipping_papers.ht... http://freakonomics.com/podcast/should-tipping-be-banned-a-new-freakonomics-radio-podcast/ http://freakonomics.com/podcast/should-tipping-be-banned-a-n... http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/17/abolish-tipping_n_5991796.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/10/17/abolish-tipping_n_5...
- techthroway443 10y ago
  > Can you provide a citation? Have you ever eaten out in your life? How many times have you left a 20 percent tip for a waiter who forgot to put in your order, brought the wrong food, was mean to you, etc.
  - toomuchtodo 10y ago
    > How many times have you left a 20 percent tip Always. If I have an issue with the service, I take it up with management. I don't short change someone's wages because of a perceived or actual deficiency. What am I? Some sort of monster? Just because the rest of society is cheap and short changes service workers because they can get away with it (until labor law gets fixed), that does not make it right. And if you say, "I can't afford to tip 20 percent all the time", well then my friend, you can't afford to be eating out. Why do you think its more costly to eat out in Europe than the US? Because staff are paid a living wage there.
    - techthroway443 10y ago
      Sure you can take it up with management but why are you giving extra money to the person who just gave you bad service? Tipping is for the quality of service you receive, and if it's bad service it's absolutely pointless for you to reward that shitty behavior. By all means go ahead but I'm not sure you quite understand the point of tipping in the first place
      - oarsinsync 10y ago
        > I'm not sure you quite understand the point of tipping in the first place The point of tipping is to prevent the employer from having to pay a fair wage. Someone who works in such industries depend on tips for their livelihoods. Not performing at 100% resulting in a significant drop in earnings isn't really fair. Given the typical audience on here, a reasonable comparison would be for employers to be docking wages based on time spent not working. Given how many of us visit this site at work, that could be a substantial drop in wages. Then again, you might be making so much money that it doesn't impact you. Servers aren't. They might just be having a bad day. Their mistakes on serving you will have less of an impact on your life than your not tipping them. Most of them are human beings trying to survive. Most of them are not making enough to do more than that.
readams 10y ago
The research is clear the the tips have very little to do with quality of service, and much more to do with who the customers are and who the servers are. More, waiters getting low tips tend to think their customers are cheap and not that their service was poor. So when he says that this doesn't happen it's a claim that is well supported by research.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]