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Iceland makes it very explicit that emergency assistance is free of charge and that if you're in trouble, you should call without hesitation (they even have an

Iceland makes it very explicit that emergency assistance is free of charge and that if you're in trouble, you should call without hesitation (they even have an app where you click a button and your position is transmitted to the SAR center). This policy saves lives, but unfortunately there's a tendency these days in some countries to back-charge for SAR ops when they are a result of irresponsible choices like many mentioned in the article. Thumbs up for Iceland!

Swizec 10y ago
That's what we do in Slovenian alps. Rescue is free and immediate. Just call and volunteers come get you. But if you're in trouble because of negligence or improper equipment - like hiking at 6000ft in high heels [1] - then we send you a receipt. [1] some of the stories that make it into the news are really crazy. Like a group of high school students that went on an half day hike without food or water just in their t-shirts. By the time they were rescued, after getting lost, almost all of them had hypothermia. I think criminal charges were brought against the teacher.
- Quequau 10y ago
  I'm not 100% informed on the details but when I moved to Austria, I joined the Alpenverein. I understand that part of the yearly membership dues go for providing some sort of rescue insurance. Seems like a good arrangement to me.
  - Xylakant 10y ago
    Usually the membership fee in an alpenverein includes an insurance that covers rescue/recovery costs up to a certain limit (25k in austria [1], similar in germany). There are alpenverein sections all over europe, so if you like to go climbing and hiking in the mountains, being a member is a good investment. They also take care of maintaining shelters and marking/maintaining the hiking routes. You also get a guaranteed place to sleep in the huts - though you might have to squeeze on a bench in the guest room if you're late and the place is full. [1] http://www.alpenverein.at/portal/service/mitgliedschaft/mitgliedervorteile/0100_weltweit-versichert.php?navid=971928971928 http://www.alpenverein.at/portal/service/mitgliedschaft/mitg...
- saiya-jin 10y ago
  France has free chopper rescues from, well anywhere, no questions asked (the line between uninformed decision and negligence can be pretty blurry especially if a lot of cash/criminal charges are floating around). There are cases of inexperienced climbers (one I know from Poland) where reluctance to call chopper in critical situation due to worries of costs (plus losing the face) cost 3 young guys lives. Too many like these. Chopper rescues in alps are in almost daily order (especially in winter in places like Vallee Blanche, best and longest of-piste in Europe). A friend of mine was rescued like this in Calanques next to Marseille after she broke her feet after climbing accident. Chopper was called due to inaccessible terrain, and she had a cool ride hanging from chopper by harness over Mediterranean sea.
  - snaily 10y ago
    > Vallee Blanche, best and longest of-piste in Europe Longest, by virtue of being very flat. Scenery is great, but the ride is (sometimes literally) pedestrian.
    - saiya-jin 10y ago
      well, you do some 2800m altitude difference in 21 kms. math is clear there, no magic involved :)
- arethuza 10y ago
  "I think criminal charges were brought against the teacher." People often complain that the risk assessments that schools in the UK have to do are overkill. However, things like this used to happen: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cairngorm_Plateau_Disaster https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cairngorm_Plateau_Disaster
MrDresden 10y ago
I was a member of the ICE-SAR for some years (left due to my inability to be active and stay up on things during my university years). Everyone, excluding a very small group of administrative and specially trained personal, take part in ICE-SAR as volunteers. There is no pay, but you do get access to some fantastic company of people, specialized equipment and training. So it is completely worth it if you enjoy any kind of out door activity, and don't mind lending a hand when people need help (most see this as normal community service). And most, if not all, members in ICE-SAR would agree that the service should be free for whom ever needs the help (for obvious reasons). However, the issue is that up until a few years back Iceland didn't have such insane influx of tourists every year (estimates for 2015 are ~1.2 million foreign nationals. That's more than 4x the total population of the country!) and the amount of calls ICE-SAR got due to tourists where manageable (there is equipment costs, fuel and then being able to leave the office to go glacial trekking for lost souls). But now the amount of calls seem (from what I hear from friends still active) to have completely caught everyone off guard. And since we don't have an army and the police force is small and mostly tied to each town/city, there are no other alternatives than ICE-SAR. And having such a strong tradition of the government/police being able to rely on the volunteer network, it is difficult to suggest a change where someone starts paying for the work. And what most people suggest is that the government starts paying more for the use of the ICE-SAR service (or support it with more funds), since all emergency calls are directed to the state run 911-esque help line that then decides if a search & rescue operation should be initiated. But you can imagine how difficult it is to start charging for something that up to this point has been free. Just as an extra note: Currently ICE-SAR gets most of it's funds through the sales of fireworks and xmas trees (fireworks are illegal to shoot up in Iceland except during xmas holidays, ~15 Dec-10 Jan) and sales of a small key chain mascot.
- throwaway7767 10y ago
  Great comment. Regarding the possibility of charging for the work, I'll add that there's also concern about keeping volunteers on. You're spot on that people volunteer for the company and access to fun equipment, but for many there's also the element of being a 'heroic volunteer'. Once you start charging for escorting tourists who stubbed their toes, some of that glitz is gone. Additionally, I've heard concerns from volunteers that if it's a paid service, the expectations change. Now, the volunteers can say 'no' if asked to do something they don't want to do. If it's a service that's charged for (even if it's the government putting in direct funding), the dynamics of the relationship change. If adding government money to the mix results in fewer volunteers, it's likely that the cost of the operation would go up instead of down, as they'd need to add paid rescuers. As an aside, this is similar to the issues the Tor Project has been discussing for a while. There are proposals to economically incentivize people to run exit relays. But right now, most exit relays are run at a loss to volunteers, and it's unlikely that such a scheme could actually pay for the entire cost of the infrastructure required. So what happens if you start paying, but less than the cost? It stops being altruistic, and becomes an economic calculation that does not make sense. It's likely that you'd lose a lot of the idealistic relay operators, which are exactly the ones you want to keep.

Swizec 10y ago

That's what we do in Slovenian alps. Rescue is free and immediate. Just call and volunteers come get you. But if you're in trouble because of negligence or improper equipment - like hiking at 6000ft in high heels [1] - then we send you a receipt. [1] some of the stories that make it into the news are really crazy. Like a group of high school students that went on an half day hike without food or water just in their t-shirts. By the time they were rescued, after getting lost, almost all of them had hypothermia. I think criminal charges were brought against the teacher.

Quequau 10y ago
I'm not 100% informed on the details but when I moved to Austria, I joined the Alpenverein. I understand that part of the yearly membership dues go for providing some sort of rescue insurance. Seems like a good arrangement to me.
- Xylakant 10y ago
  Usually the membership fee in an alpenverein includes an insurance that covers rescue/recovery costs up to a certain limit (25k in austria [1], similar in germany). There are alpenverein sections all over europe, so if you like to go climbing and hiking in the mountains, being a member is a good investment. They also take care of maintaining shelters and marking/maintaining the hiking routes. You also get a guaranteed place to sleep in the huts - though you might have to squeeze on a bench in the guest room if you're late and the place is full. [1] http://www.alpenverein.at/portal/service/mitgliedschaft/mitgliedervorteile/0100_weltweit-versichert.php?navid=971928971928 http://www.alpenverein.at/portal/service/mitgliedschaft/mitg...
saiya-jin 10y ago
France has free chopper rescues from, well anywhere, no questions asked (the line between uninformed decision and negligence can be pretty blurry especially if a lot of cash/criminal charges are floating around). There are cases of inexperienced climbers (one I know from Poland) where reluctance to call chopper in critical situation due to worries of costs (plus losing the face) cost 3 young guys lives. Too many like these. Chopper rescues in alps are in almost daily order (especially in winter in places like Vallee Blanche, best and longest of-piste in Europe). A friend of mine was rescued like this in Calanques next to Marseille after she broke her feet after climbing accident. Chopper was called due to inaccessible terrain, and she had a cool ride hanging from chopper by harness over Mediterranean sea.
- snaily 10y ago
  > Vallee Blanche, best and longest of-piste in Europe Longest, by virtue of being very flat. Scenery is great, but the ride is (sometimes literally) pedestrian.
  - saiya-jin 10y ago
    well, you do some 2800m altitude difference in 21 kms. math is clear there, no magic involved :)
arethuza 10y ago
"I think criminal charges were brought against the teacher." People often complain that the risk assessments that schools in the UK have to do are overkill. However, things like this used to happen: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cairngorm_Plateau_Disaster https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cairngorm_Plateau_Disaster

MrDresden 10y ago

I was a member of the ICE-SAR for some years (left due to my inability to be active and stay up on things during my university years). Everyone, excluding a very small group of administrative and specially trained personal, take part in ICE-SAR as volunteers. There is no pay, but you do get access to some fantastic company of people, specialized equipment and training. So it is completely worth it if you enjoy any kind of out door activity, and don't mind lending a hand when people need help (most see this as normal community service). And most, if not all, members in ICE-SAR would agree that the service should be free for whom ever needs the help (for obvious reasons). However, the issue is that up until a few years back Iceland didn't have such insane influx of tourists every year (estimates for 2015 are ~1.2 million foreign nationals. That's more than 4x the total population of the country!) and the amount of calls ICE-SAR got due to tourists where manageable (there is equipment costs, fuel and then being able to leave the office to go glacial trekking for lost souls). But now the amount of calls seem (from what I hear from friends still active) to have completely caught everyone off guard. And since we don't have an army and the police force is small and mostly tied to each town/city, there are no other alternatives than ICE-SAR. And having such a strong tradition of the government/police being able to rely on the volunteer network, it is difficult to suggest a change where someone starts paying for the work. And what most people suggest is that the government starts paying more for the use of the ICE-SAR service (or support it with more funds), since all emergency calls are directed to the state run 911-esque help line that then decides if a search & rescue operation should be initiated. But you can imagine how difficult it is to start charging for something that up to this point has been free. Just as an extra note: Currently ICE-SAR gets most of it's funds through the sales of fireworks and xmas trees (fireworks are illegal to shoot up in Iceland except during xmas holidays, ~15 Dec-10 Jan) and sales of a small key chain mascot.

throwaway7767 10y ago
Great comment. Regarding the possibility of charging for the work, I'll add that there's also concern about keeping volunteers on. You're spot on that people volunteer for the company and access to fun equipment, but for many there's also the element of being a 'heroic volunteer'. Once you start charging for escorting tourists who stubbed their toes, some of that glitz is gone. Additionally, I've heard concerns from volunteers that if it's a paid service, the expectations change. Now, the volunteers can say 'no' if asked to do something they don't want to do. If it's a service that's charged for (even if it's the government putting in direct funding), the dynamics of the relationship change. If adding government money to the mix results in fewer volunteers, it's likely that the cost of the operation would go up instead of down, as they'd need to add paid rescuers. As an aside, this is similar to the issues the Tor Project has been discussing for a while. There are proposals to economically incentivize people to run exit relays. But right now, most exit relays are run at a loss to volunteers, and it's unlikely that such a scheme could actually pay for the entire cost of the infrastructure required. So what happens if you start paying, but less than the cost? It stops being altruistic, and becomes an economic calculation that does not make sense. It's likely that you'd lose a lot of the idealistic relay operators, which are exactly the ones you want to keep.