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> too much testosterone in individuals may actually be a detriment to the society as a whole. That's what my point was. Civilizations rise when less aggressive

> too much testosterone in individuals may actually be a detriment to the society as a whole. That's what my point was. Civilizations rise when less aggressive males are "dominating" the sexual market, but that civilization is also vulnerable to more aggressive males and once exposed to them, it crumbles. We can also see this effect to some extent in western civilization.

dmix 10y ago
The Roman Empire largely fell because they were overexposed militarily. So one could equally argue that their hyper-masculinism was their downfall - not their lack of competitiveness. If they showed more prudence and were less aggressive at everyone around them they would have been better prepared for the attacks from the Goths and barbarians. Additionally, they were overextended financially as well which left them in a weak state. Over-extension is the result of highly risky behavior, which is comparable to the cowboy Wall St jockeys of the present era which are definitely a modern masculine image. Avoiding the extremes seems to be where progress is made. Being neither overly aggressive nor so weak you get walked over by the tougher kids on the block. The boring times in history were great times for economies (see 1990s, post-WW2 America), there were still some military adventurism but mostly short-lived minor disputes (Korea, Desert Storm). Modern statecraft is largely about economics today, not militarism. For example, I would doubt the US could fall from a lack of military prowess, while still totally dominating the world financial markets. Money goes a much longer way than guns and heart these days. Just look at how Russia's economy is doing these days - despite being the toughest kid on the block. Even if they succeed at war mongering it could only take them so far before the west could obliterate their citizens quality of life without firing a shot.
- bernawil 10y ago
  They were not overexposed militarily. After conquering and integrating the whole mediterranean basin they only had two rivaling neighbors: Germanic peoples at the north and the parthians-sassanid-persians in the east. In times of integrity they managed just fine. The only reason the germans survived history to hurt the empire was because the Antonine emperors didn't want to genocide them. Then the empire had a stint of epidemics and bad luck that degradated socitey and the political system, leading to constant civil war.

dmix 10y ago

The Roman Empire largely fell because they were overexposed militarily. So one could equally argue that their hyper-masculinism was their downfall - not their lack of competitiveness. If they showed more prudence and were less aggressive at everyone around them they would have been better prepared for the attacks from the Goths and barbarians. Additionally, they were overextended financially as well which left them in a weak state. Over-extension is the result of highly risky behavior, which is comparable to the cowboy Wall St jockeys of the present era which are definitely a modern masculine image. Avoiding the extremes seems to be where progress is made. Being neither overly aggressive nor so weak you get walked over by the tougher kids on the block. The boring times in history were great times for economies (see 1990s, post-WW2 America), there were still some military adventurism but mostly short-lived minor disputes (Korea, Desert Storm). Modern statecraft is largely about economics today, not militarism. For example, I would doubt the US could fall from a lack of military prowess, while still totally dominating the world financial markets. Money goes a much longer way than guns and heart these days. Just look at how Russia's economy is doing these days - despite being the toughest kid on the block. Even if they succeed at war mongering it could only take them so far before the west could obliterate their citizens quality of life without firing a shot.

bernawil 10y ago
They were not overexposed militarily. After conquering and integrating the whole mediterranean basin they only had two rivaling neighbors: Germanic peoples at the north and the parthians-sassanid-persians in the east. In times of integrity they managed just fine. The only reason the germans survived history to hurt the empire was because the Antonine emperors didn't want to genocide them. Then the empire had a stint of epidemics and bad luck that degradated socitey and the political system, leading to constant civil war.