7 ms·

We already see hints of previously unfathomable jobs. OK, so in Wall-E, no one did squat because the ship was self-contained and fully automated. But let's pon

We already see hints of previously unfathomable jobs. OK, so in Wall-E, no one did squat because the ship was self-contained and fully automated. But let's ponder the world that exists somewhere between today and Wall-E. Entertainment is a profession. It's "kind of a rare one" right now, but it's becoming more and more of one. Whether you're "YouTube famous" or "that kid on Vine" or you've got a Twitch channel that makes you money, people pay just to watch other people be entertained or do something "useless" but somehow interesting. Obviously, the bigger question in that article was "how money will be distributed and exchanged." Can a huge plurality of people be "Wall-E entertained" sustainably, while some do "critical" jobs (if there are any critical jobs that are still done by humans - hardware/network maintenance, software programming, will the vision of the future be determined by humans or AI?)

CocaKoala 11y ago
How are the people supporting the entertainers getting money? By doing their own entertaining?
- neogodless 11y ago
  Yes - that was a big part of my question. Can the masses simple be entertained (a la Wall-E) without contributing anything?!
  - CocaKoala 11y ago
    I'm not certain you understood my question, or perhaps I misunderstood your statement. It seems to me that you're saying a small minority of people will work as entertainers (and presumably get paid for doing so) while another small minority fulfills critical functions that can't be automated, and the majority sits back to be entertained. What I'm not clear on is where the money comes from to pay the entertainers and the critical maintainers, if the majority aren't working. The money can't come from the masses, because the masses aren't employed. Are you suggesting that in this scenario, it's a post-scarcity society, money is never transferred at all, and that's why it works?
GauntletWizard 11y ago
Youtubers are already showing (and Camgirls showed long before) that you can, to a large extent, sell friendship. It can be a mass market product, or it can be something fairly niche. A history professor with a hobby for Collectible Card games made a successful transition into a youtube webseries host[1][2]. I give some money each month to eSports personalities like Day[9], TotalBiscuit, Neuro; each of whom address their viewers as friends (with cute nicknames). Twitch is a media empire built entirely around this interaction, but Youtube's success with PewDiePie and Markiplier is essentially the same thing. People are willing to pay to watch friends being friends - Most of RoosterTeeth's entertainment product is basically just that. But we've also seen niche markets be more effectively catered to. I'm running up a decent bill on Patreon each month, less than I would for a cable subscription, and I feel somewhat overwhelmed by the interactions I am having, even if they're somewhat passive. I see the future of work looking a lot like migrant laborers sending remittances does now, but with a very different scale and breadth. A lot of mid-sized communities (small towns), where there's a single major breadwinner and a bunch of entertainment and services to support them, but without the vassalage that this lead to in the past because of the interconnectedness of the social graph and the amount of flexibility that allows. The new social structures are going to look somewhat between an extended family and an orgy. The social ties are moving from fixed points like blood and religion into common interests and value sets... which are well predicted by the old indicators, but not exclusively tied to. I just hope that we survive it, because the re-org will not be pretty. Tribalism and fear of the unknown are still powerful factors, even if the widening of personality-space has weakened them. [1]https://np.reddit.com/r/magicTCG/comments/35pjuq/tolarian_community_college_talks_about_youtube/cr6r7sg https://np.reddit.com/r/magicTCG/comments/35pjuq/tolarian_co... [2]https://www.patreon.com/tolariancommunitycollege https://www.patreon.com/tolariancommunitycollege

CocaKoala 11y ago

How are the people supporting the entertainers getting money? By doing their own entertaining?

neogodless 11y ago
Yes - that was a big part of my question. Can the masses simple be entertained (a la Wall-E) without contributing anything?!
- CocaKoala 11y ago
  I'm not certain you understood my question, or perhaps I misunderstood your statement. It seems to me that you're saying a small minority of people will work as entertainers (and presumably get paid for doing so) while another small minority fulfills critical functions that can't be automated, and the majority sits back to be entertained. What I'm not clear on is where the money comes from to pay the entertainers and the critical maintainers, if the majority aren't working. The money can't come from the masses, because the masses aren't employed. Are you suggesting that in this scenario, it's a post-scarcity society, money is never transferred at all, and that's why it works?

GauntletWizard 11y ago

Youtubers are already showing (and Camgirls showed long before) that you can, to a large extent, sell friendship. It can be a mass market product, or it can be something fairly niche. A history professor with a hobby for Collectible Card games made a successful transition into a youtube webseries host[1][2]. I give some money each month to eSports personalities like Day[9], TotalBiscuit, Neuro; each of whom address their viewers as friends (with cute nicknames). Twitch is a media empire built entirely around this interaction, but Youtube's success with PewDiePie and Markiplier is essentially the same thing. People are willing to pay to watch friends being friends - Most of RoosterTeeth's entertainment product is basically just that. But we've also seen niche markets be more effectively catered to. I'm running up a decent bill on Patreon each month, less than I would for a cable subscription, and I feel somewhat overwhelmed by the interactions I am having, even if they're somewhat passive. I see the future of work looking a lot like migrant laborers sending remittances does now, but with a very different scale and breadth. A lot of mid-sized communities (small towns), where there's a single major breadwinner and a bunch of entertainment and services to support them, but without the vassalage that this lead to in the past because of the interconnectedness of the social graph and the amount of flexibility that allows. The new social structures are going to look somewhat between an extended family and an orgy. The social ties are moving from fixed points like blood and religion into common interests and value sets... which are well predicted by the old indicators, but not exclusively tied to. I just hope that we survive it, because the re-org will not be pretty. Tribalism and fear of the unknown are still powerful factors, even if the widening of personality-space has weakened them. [1]https://np.reddit.com/r/magicTCG/comments/35pjuq/tolarian_community_college_talks_about_youtube/cr6r7sg https://np.reddit.com/r/magicTCG/comments/35pjuq/tolarian_co... [2]https://www.patreon.com/tolariancommunitycollege https://www.patreon.com/tolariancommunitycollege