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Yes, I am thriving with a niche C++/Win32 graphics app. Web apps are a long way from having the responsiveness and control of a desktop app. Do you really thin

Yes, I am thriving with a niche C++/Win32 graphics app. Web apps are a long way from having the responsiveness and control of a desktop app. Do you really think users will be doing Photoshop and AutoCAD in a browser? No matter if you have a fibre op connection, the lag is always there. Recently the main player in this domain moved to Web apps. There was an overwhelming protest from its customers, who insisted they prefer the desktop version.

AshleysBrain 10y ago
> Web apps are a long way from having the responsiveness and control of a desktop app. I don't think this is the case. Facebook never needed desktop apps, did they? The web worked great for them.
- wslh 10y ago
  But they have a native mobile app where the FB main consumption happens.
- gcatalfamo 10y ago
  I don't think you can compare the way you use Facebook with the way you would use AutoCAD or Photoshop...
  - AshleysBrain 10y ago
    Maybe not for those cases, but a lot of apps aren't as demanding as those. So I don't think you can say in general that the web can't compete with desktop apps, maybe only just for specialist cases. The web is good enough that it didn't stop Facebook becoming a billion-dollar company. Mobile is a different matter, but think on desktop how many services are fine to work web only on desktop with no desktop app (especially if they have a mobile app).
- fekberg 10y ago
  Depends on the audience and the application. As Photoshop and AutoCad are both mentioned, I think that's the benchmark and not something like Facebook that wouldn't benefit as much from running as a desktop client. On a side-note, didn't Facebook just release a new UWP app and didn't they regret going the HTML5 route to start with (not focusing on native apps)?
  - AshleysBrain 10y ago
    They were fine for years without any kind of desktop app, and the HTML5 backtracking was just for mobile. I don't think they ever said they regretted being web-only on desktop from the start. In fact I think it is even a big reason for their success - would Facebook have taken off if it had an installer?
lugus35 10y ago
Well, as an autocad replacement you have: https://www.onshape.com/ https://www.onshape.com/ and as a Photoshop replacement, you have things like : https://pixlr.com/ https://pixlr.com/ And yes, there are people using these online tools.
- khedoros 10y ago
  OK, yes, people use those. How many people actually use them as replacements for the tools you mentioned? Are they practical alternatives, or "alternatives" in the sense that Gimp is an alternative to Photoshop?
- delhanty 10y ago
  Onshape is much closer to a cloud version of Solidworks than to a cloud version of AutoCAD.
kraftman 10y ago
You don't need a fibre connection to run JS client side...
- KaiserPro 10y ago
  You do to get simulations working properly. Also if you are offloading stuff to the cloud you need low latency.
- wilonth 10y ago
  Right, but you can't write intensive algorithms and procedures in JS, because it would be very slow, you have to move those to the server side, which incurs the network lag.
jobead 10y ago
Ahh, AutoCAD...the desktop app that pretty much _ruined_ me for all future applications. The first application that I ever used to actually create something new, before I even really learned to write code. The beauty of AutoCAD was that it was designed for power users only. The learning curve was almost vertical...but to me, that's the true sign of a powerful application. Fortunately, I had a high-school drafting class and then took a class at my local community college...having a real-life instructor was invaluable. It was exclusively designed around a "one hand on keyboard, one hand on mouse" stance, but you could do _everything_ from that position. Once I got over the the initial learning hump and most of the commands became second nature, I could work almost as fast as I could think. I was working on something like a 500Mhz PIII running Win98, and I cannot remember it ever lagging or crashing while I was working. But the most important thing to me? Since it was a desktop app, it had 100% control over the keyboard and mouse inputs. No accidentally closing a tab or refreshing the page. No browser updates f'ing with my right click menu. No scroll-jacking. No zoom-jacking. No shortcut-key overlap with plugins (looking at you, 1Password/google docs) No input lag...EVER. I miss that level of user/machine interface...Every. Single. Day.

AshleysBrain 10y ago

> Web apps are a long way from having the responsiveness and control of a desktop app. I don't think this is the case. Facebook never needed desktop apps, did they? The web worked great for them.

wslh 10y ago
But they have a native mobile app where the FB main consumption happens.
gcatalfamo 10y ago
I don't think you can compare the way you use Facebook with the way you would use AutoCAD or Photoshop...
- AshleysBrain 10y ago
  Maybe not for those cases, but a lot of apps aren't as demanding as those. So I don't think you can say in general that the web can't compete with desktop apps, maybe only just for specialist cases. The web is good enough that it didn't stop Facebook becoming a billion-dollar company. Mobile is a different matter, but think on desktop how many services are fine to work web only on desktop with no desktop app (especially if they have a mobile app).
fekberg 10y ago
Depends on the audience and the application. As Photoshop and AutoCad are both mentioned, I think that's the benchmark and not something like Facebook that wouldn't benefit as much from running as a desktop client. On a side-note, didn't Facebook just release a new UWP app and didn't they regret going the HTML5 route to start with (not focusing on native apps)?
- AshleysBrain 10y ago
  They were fine for years without any kind of desktop app, and the HTML5 backtracking was just for mobile. I don't think they ever said they regretted being web-only on desktop from the start. In fact I think it is even a big reason for their success - would Facebook have taken off if it had an installer?

lugus35 10y ago

Well, as an autocad replacement you have: https://www.onshape.com/ https://www.onshape.com/ and as a Photoshop replacement, you have things like : https://pixlr.com/ https://pixlr.com/ And yes, there are people using these online tools.

khedoros 10y ago
OK, yes, people use those. How many people actually use them as replacements for the tools you mentioned? Are they practical alternatives, or "alternatives" in the sense that Gimp is an alternative to Photoshop?
delhanty 10y ago
Onshape is much closer to a cloud version of Solidworks than to a cloud version of AutoCAD.

kraftman 10y ago

You don't need a fibre connection to run JS client side...

KaiserPro 10y ago
You do to get simulations working properly. Also if you are offloading stuff to the cloud you need low latency.
wilonth 10y ago
Right, but you can't write intensive algorithms and procedures in JS, because it would be very slow, you have to move those to the server side, which incurs the network lag.

jobead 10y ago

Ahh, AutoCAD...the desktop app that pretty much _ruined_ me for all future applications. The first application that I ever used to actually create something new, before I even really learned to write code. The beauty of AutoCAD was that it was designed for power users only. The learning curve was almost vertical...but to me, that's the true sign of a powerful application. Fortunately, I had a high-school drafting class and then took a class at my local community college...having a real-life instructor was invaluable. It was exclusively designed around a "one hand on keyboard, one hand on mouse" stance, but you could do _everything_ from that position. Once I got over the the initial learning hump and most of the commands became second nature, I could work almost as fast as I could think. I was working on something like a 500Mhz PIII running Win98, and I cannot remember it ever lagging or crashing while I was working. But the most important thing to me? Since it was a desktop app, it had 100% control over the keyboard and mouse inputs. No accidentally closing a tab or refreshing the page. No browser updates f'ing with my right click menu. No scroll-jacking. No zoom-jacking. No shortcut-key overlap with plugins (looking at you, 1Password/google docs) No input lag...EVER. I miss that level of user/machine interface...Every. Single. Day.