3 ms·

I remember trying this one and thinking that the language was fine(it is literally an update from the makers of the Atari 8-bit BASIC) but the UI is unsuitable

by chipsy 10y ago

I remember trying this one and thinking that the language was fine(it is literally an update from the makers of the Atari 8-bit BASIC) but the UI is unsuitable as it uses generic Android text input, the same flaw shared by most every other on-device IDE I've tried. That doesn't just mean that it's crude, it's also buggy - the view desynchronizes when editing large bodies of text using that text control. What touchscreen programming needs is a really polished touchscreen UI, and that challenges the whole assumption of a text editor being ergonomically optimal.

pjmlp 10y ago
Lisping is a very good example on iOS of coding with touch. https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/lisping/id512138518?mt=8 https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/lisping/id512138518?mt=8 I am yet to find something similar on Android.
- drdaeman 10y ago
  How about https://mad.cs.fau.de/fasl/ https://mad.cs.fau.de/fasl/? Unfortunately, the development seems to have completely stalled and the site's partially dead, but it's still in the Play Store: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=de.fau.cs.mad.fasl https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=de.fau.cs.mad...., and the source's on Bitbucket: https://bitbucket.org/mad_fau/fasl https://bitbucket.org/mad_fau/fasl
  - pjmlp 10y ago
    Doesn't look as user friendly. Check the iPad screenshots, https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/lisping/id512138518?mt=8# https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/lisping/id512138518?mt=8# However I never tried it, just saw a demo of it a while back.
- sspiff 10y ago
  I think LISP is an excellent fit for the poor text input facilities that touchscreens offer. Structuring, wrapping an navigating code bodies is very easy, thanks to the simple syntax structure of the language, and you need very few uncommon characters (parens, quotes and dashes being the most common ones), buttons for which would easily be fitted into the touchscreen UI. auto-completion is also pretty simple, since most of the time the first entry of a non-quoted list will be a function listed somewhere near in a defun, and other entries will often be an identifier nearby. Other cases, such as constants, new identifiers or unknown functions, will need more input work from the user, but this is still feasible.
  - pjmlp 10y ago
    Yes, but there is other area that I think it keeps unexplored, taking advantage of writing recognition to write programs. Just writing down as one would be on a piece of paper. Many tablets have their algorithms quite good nowadays and yet developers use them to create ToDo list apps. There is just a few Android apps I know that make use of it for drawing diagrams.
- jarcane 10y ago
  I desperately wish there was an Android port of Lisping. I want it badly, but iOS devices are ludicrously expensive in my country. In the interim, I've found hacked (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.hackedapp https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.hackedapp), while a game, I think actually does a pretty good job as an interface. It's largely pleasant to work with, save that I would prefer to be able to name my own vars. The game itself jumps in difficulty rather quickly though, by chapter 3 or 4 you are already asked to write a sort algorithm in what is a pretty restricted language. On Windows Phone I was also really impressed with Touch C (https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/apps/touch-c/9wzdncrdr394 https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/apps/touch-c/9wzdncrdr...) as an interface, it's just a shame that the implementation was so buggy and incomplete.
dukoid 10y ago
I have tried two approaches to address these problems: "Pure" graphical programming (http://flowgrid.org http://flowgrid.org) and collapsed function declarations, avoiding large text bodies (although for JS, not BASIC: https://tidejnet.appspot.com/v3/ https://tidejnet.appspot.com/v3/). Both are still prototype-ish, but if you take a look, let me know what you think should be improved..
arikrak 10y ago
Microsoft has something like that: https://www.touchdevelop.com/ https://www.touchdevelop.com/ People have also built tools off of Google Blockly: https://developers.google.com/blockly/about/showcase https://developers.google.com/blockly/about/showcase

by chipsy 10y ago

pjmlp 10y ago

Lisping is a very good example on iOS of coding with touch. https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/lisping/id512138518?mt=8 https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/lisping/id512138518?mt=8 I am yet to find something similar on Android.

drdaeman 10y ago
How about https://mad.cs.fau.de/fasl/ https://mad.cs.fau.de/fasl/? Unfortunately, the development seems to have completely stalled and the site's partially dead, but it's still in the Play Store: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=de.fau.cs.mad.fasl https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=de.fau.cs.mad...., and the source's on Bitbucket: https://bitbucket.org/mad_fau/fasl https://bitbucket.org/mad_fau/fasl
- pjmlp 10y ago
  Doesn't look as user friendly. Check the iPad screenshots, https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/lisping/id512138518?mt=8# https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/lisping/id512138518?mt=8# However I never tried it, just saw a demo of it a while back.
sspiff 10y ago
I think LISP is an excellent fit for the poor text input facilities that touchscreens offer. Structuring, wrapping an navigating code bodies is very easy, thanks to the simple syntax structure of the language, and you need very few uncommon characters (parens, quotes and dashes being the most common ones), buttons for which would easily be fitted into the touchscreen UI. auto-completion is also pretty simple, since most of the time the first entry of a non-quoted list will be a function listed somewhere near in a defun, and other entries will often be an identifier nearby. Other cases, such as constants, new identifiers or unknown functions, will need more input work from the user, but this is still feasible.
- pjmlp 10y ago
  Yes, but there is other area that I think it keeps unexplored, taking advantage of writing recognition to write programs. Just writing down as one would be on a piece of paper. Many tablets have their algorithms quite good nowadays and yet developers use them to create ToDo list apps. There is just a few Android apps I know that make use of it for drawing diagrams.
jarcane 10y ago
I desperately wish there was an Android port of Lisping. I want it badly, but iOS devices are ludicrously expensive in my country. In the interim, I've found hacked (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.hackedapp https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.hackedapp), while a game, I think actually does a pretty good job as an interface. It's largely pleasant to work with, save that I would prefer to be able to name my own vars. The game itself jumps in difficulty rather quickly though, by chapter 3 or 4 you are already asked to write a sort algorithm in what is a pretty restricted language. On Windows Phone I was also really impressed with Touch C (https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/apps/touch-c/9wzdncrdr394 https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/store/apps/touch-c/9wzdncrdr...) as an interface, it's just a shame that the implementation was so buggy and incomplete.

dukoid 10y ago

I have tried two approaches to address these problems: "Pure" graphical programming (http://flowgrid.org http://flowgrid.org) and collapsed function declarations, avoiding large text bodies (although for JS, not BASIC: https://tidejnet.appspot.com/v3/ https://tidejnet.appspot.com/v3/). Both are still prototype-ish, but if you take a look, let me know what you think should be improved..

arikrak 10y ago

Microsoft has something like that: https://www.touchdevelop.com/ https://www.touchdevelop.com/ People have also built tools off of Google Blockly: https://developers.google.com/blockly/about/showcase https://developers.google.com/blockly/about/showcase