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Do you think that by using tariffs for political pressure, we can force China to raise their standard of living to developed-country levels? Otherwise, this jus

by evanpw 10y ago

Do you think that by using tariffs for political pressure, we can force China to raise their standard of living to developed-country levels? Otherwise, this just amounts to a transfer from the Chinese poor to the American poor, which seems like a big net loss morally.

jvm 10y ago
It seems pretty clear that China would like their standard of living to be higher, and in fact it is rising at almost unprecedented rates [1] which have been sustained for over a decade. I'm sure they could do an even better job but I'm not sure I see how tariffs would bring that about. [1] https://www.eca-international.com/news/november-2015/chinese-workers-to-receive-the-second-highest-glob https://www.eca-international.com/news/november-2015/chinese...
Inconel 10y ago
I'm curious why you would label the transfer from the Chinese poor to the American poor as a net loss morally? Is the transfer from the American poor to the Chinese poor also morally suspect? I'm not trying to be argumentative, just genuinely curious about your statement. Is it a moral loss because the American poor are still relatively better off than their Chinese counterparts or something else?
- evanpw 10y ago
  Yes, the typical Chinese factory worker (who would not even be particularly poor by Chinese standards) is quite a bit poorer than the typical displaced American factory worker, so there should be a strong presumption against transferring wealth from the former to the latter.
chiaro 10y ago
In practice, it's done the opposite way. The implementation of work condition standards is a standard feature of trade liberalisation agreements, including the TPP. Manufacturing tariffs are, indeed, a wealth transfer from foreign producers and domestic consumers to the owners and workers of domestic production. Of course, this is a highly inefficient way to do this transfer, and you'd be better off redistributing the broad gains from free trade. You'd be hard pressed to find a Trump supporter admit that they are looking for government handouts, though.

by evanpw 10y ago

jvm 10y ago

It seems pretty clear that China would like their standard of living to be higher, and in fact it is rising at almost unprecedented rates [1] which have been sustained for over a decade. I'm sure they could do an even better job but I'm not sure I see how tariffs would bring that about. [1] https://www.eca-international.com/news/november-2015/chinese-workers-to-receive-the-second-highest-glob https://www.eca-international.com/news/november-2015/chinese...

Inconel 10y ago

I'm curious why you would label the transfer from the Chinese poor to the American poor as a net loss morally? Is the transfer from the American poor to the Chinese poor also morally suspect? I'm not trying to be argumentative, just genuinely curious about your statement. Is it a moral loss because the American poor are still relatively better off than their Chinese counterparts or something else?

evanpw 10y ago
Yes, the typical Chinese factory worker (who would not even be particularly poor by Chinese standards) is quite a bit poorer than the typical displaced American factory worker, so there should be a strong presumption against transferring wealth from the former to the latter.

chiaro 10y ago

In practice, it's done the opposite way. The implementation of work condition standards is a standard feature of trade liberalisation agreements, including the TPP. Manufacturing tariffs are, indeed, a wealth transfer from foreign producers and domestic consumers to the owners and workers of domestic production. Of course, this is a highly inefficient way to do this transfer, and you'd be better off redistributing the broad gains from free trade. You'd be hard pressed to find a Trump supporter admit that they are looking for government handouts, though.