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Well, we could try to create infrastructure around bitcoin which would solve the problems related to human error, something like delegating sending/receiving to

by knivets 10y ago

Well, we could try to create infrastructure around bitcoin which would solve the problems related to human error, something like delegating sending/receiving to 3rd party which has nice UI and double checks everything. It could also store your private key. You might say that this 3rd party can be hacked -- true, but the same applies to traditional banking.

lisper 10y ago
> we could try to create infrastructure around bitcoin which would solve the problems Of course you could try, but (I predict) you will fail. The problems I've cited are fundamental problems that are built in to the bitcoin protocol by design. You can't patch your way around them. For example: > which has nice UI and double checks everything How exactly are you going to "check everything"? Remember, you have to get it 100% correct. Failures are completely unacceptable because failures are completely unrecoverable.
- knivets 10y ago
  Banking run by humans has fundamental problems as well, that's why things like bitcoin come to existence. It is just a matter of tradeoffs. AFAIK, most of the errors happen because users mistype the address or confuse the commission fee/amount fields, etc. UI could possible introduce some validations for fee/amount issue and probably require to retype the address or something else to avoid the other issue. Another issue is fraud, but it is a unavoidable product of such system, otherwise we end up with same problems traditional banking has. Fraud check means someone might deny the transaction even if your transaction is completely legit, for example, just because you are a citizen of a blacklisted country (my experience). It is easy to dismiss bitcoin when you are a citizen of 1st world country -- because you are insider and have full privileges, but when you are outsider, it gets very complicated and things like bitcoin give some promise.
  - lisper 10y ago
    > It is just a matter of tradeoffs. Indeed. > It is easy to dismiss bitcoin when you are a citizen of 1st world country -- because you are insider and have full privileges That is a very good point, and very easy for someone like me to lose sight of. Nonetheless, I think the answer is not to hand over the final arbitration authority to an algorithm, but rather to design a system where there is an open market in trust. Starting a bank should be as easy as starting a blog. The trick is to come up with a system of checks and balances so that someone who runs a crooked bank can be immediately and unambiguously called out.

by knivets 10y ago

lisper 10y ago

> we could try to create infrastructure around bitcoin which would solve the problems Of course you could try, but (I predict) you will fail. The problems I've cited are fundamental problems that are built in to the bitcoin protocol by design. You can't patch your way around them. For example: > which has nice UI and double checks everything How exactly are you going to "check everything"? Remember, you have to get it 100% correct. Failures are completely unacceptable because failures are completely unrecoverable.

knivets 10y ago
Banking run by humans has fundamental problems as well, that's why things like bitcoin come to existence. It is just a matter of tradeoffs. AFAIK, most of the errors happen because users mistype the address or confuse the commission fee/amount fields, etc. UI could possible introduce some validations for fee/amount issue and probably require to retype the address or something else to avoid the other issue. Another issue is fraud, but it is a unavoidable product of such system, otherwise we end up with same problems traditional banking has. Fraud check means someone might deny the transaction even if your transaction is completely legit, for example, just because you are a citizen of a blacklisted country (my experience). It is easy to dismiss bitcoin when you are a citizen of 1st world country -- because you are insider and have full privileges, but when you are outsider, it gets very complicated and things like bitcoin give some promise.
- lisper 10y ago
  > It is just a matter of tradeoffs. Indeed. > It is easy to dismiss bitcoin when you are a citizen of 1st world country -- because you are insider and have full privileges That is a very good point, and very easy for someone like me to lose sight of. Nonetheless, I think the answer is not to hand over the final arbitration authority to an algorithm, but rather to design a system where there is an open market in trust. Starting a bank should be as easy as starting a blog. The trick is to come up with a system of checks and balances so that someone who runs a crooked bank can be immediately and unambiguously called out.