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So you can refuse to go do it if you are randomly selected and you just forfeit your flight. How exactly does that add any protection against anything? Potentia

by almost 17y ago

So you can refuse to go do it if you are randomly selected and you just forfeit your flight. How exactly does that add any protection against anything? Potential hijackers can't just buy another plain ticket?

pbh 17y ago
Related: "Carnival Booth: An Algorithm for Defeating the Computer-Assisted Passenger Screening System," Samidh Chakrabarti, Aaron Strauss. tl;dr Anything other than random is arguably worse.
- gnosis 17y ago
  "Anything other than random is arguably worse." Why? If every passenger is screened, how is that worse than random?
  - alan-crowe 17y ago
    More expensive.
    - gnosis 17y ago
      More expensive in terms of money or in terms of lives?
avner 17y ago
This is security through obscurity. To quote Bruce Schneier: Security is both a reality and a feeling. The reality of security is mathematical, based on the probability of different risks and the effectiveness of different countermeasure... Security is also a feeling, based on individual psychological reactions to both the risks and the countermeasures. And the two things are different: You can be secure even though you don't feel secure, and you can feel secure even though you're not really secure." The body scanners give the reactionary populous a reason to "feel" secure; even though the chances of a terrorist being caught by body scanners are slim. (see http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2010/01/german_tv_on_th.html#comments http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2010/01/german_tv_on_t...)
- jcl 17y ago
  I think you mean "security theater". "Security through obscurity" would mean that there is some flaw in the security that the defenders are aware of but that they are hoping the attackers don't realize or guess at -- but in this case the flaw is pretty obvious to anyone who takes more than a superficial look at the system.
staunch 17y ago
Yeah: http://www.schneier.com/essay-241.html http://www.schneier.com/essay-241.html
deleted 17y ago
[deleted]
mrduncan 17y ago
I actually noticed signs (at IND) a few days ago saying that the scanners were optional. If you chose not to be scanned, you would get a pat-down instead.

by almost 17y ago

pbh 17y ago

Related: "Carnival Booth: An Algorithm for Defeating the Computer-Assisted Passenger Screening System," Samidh Chakrabarti, Aaron Strauss. tl;dr Anything other than random is arguably worse.

gnosis 17y ago
"Anything other than random is arguably worse." Why? If every passenger is screened, how is that worse than random?
- alan-crowe 17y ago
  More expensive.
  - gnosis 17y ago
    More expensive in terms of money or in terms of lives?

avner 17y ago

This is security through obscurity. To quote Bruce Schneier: Security is both a reality and a feeling. The reality of security is mathematical, based on the probability of different risks and the effectiveness of different countermeasure... Security is also a feeling, based on individual psychological reactions to both the risks and the countermeasures. And the two things are different: You can be secure even though you don't feel secure, and you can feel secure even though you're not really secure." The body scanners give the reactionary populous a reason to "feel" secure; even though the chances of a terrorist being caught by body scanners are slim. (see http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2010/01/german_tv_on_th.html#comments http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2010/01/german_tv_on_t...)

jcl 17y ago
I think you mean "security theater". "Security through obscurity" would mean that there is some flaw in the security that the defenders are aware of but that they are hoping the attackers don't realize or guess at -- but in this case the flaw is pretty obvious to anyone who takes more than a superficial look at the system.

staunch 17y ago

Yeah: http://www.schneier.com/essay-241.html http://www.schneier.com/essay-241.html

deleted 17y ago

[deleted]

mrduncan 17y ago

I actually noticed signs (at IND) a few days ago saying that the scanners were optional. If you chose not to be scanned, you would get a pat-down instead.