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> Early candidates running for the pacifist party, I guess, given I can't recall reading about anyone platforming against existence of intelligence gathering ag

> Early candidates running for the pacifist party, I guess, given I can't recall reading about anyone platforming against existence of intelligence gathering agency. Anyone who could or was running for office that believed America should be only major power post-Ww2 that didn't have spies. Enough votes that direction might have resulted in the dissolution of our intelligence agencies that were forming. And probably the dissolution of or great damage to our country later given the leaders would be acting blind. But you'd have a chance. So you agree that such a spy agency was, in fact, not voted in.

nickpsecurity 11y ago
The forerunners were created in secret for use against enemies during the World War's under Presidents voted in. The people's voted-in Congress representatives that made them official with more authority. Then people kept voting-in even more that kept them over time with no major push to vote out intelligence agencies. Just reform their bad behaviors on occasion. So, yes, they were voted in and maintained through the elected representatives. That's how a representational democracy works. There was also no pushback strong enough to affect an election and dissolve an intelligence agency. They'd be diminished or gone had that happened. So, voters wanted the situation and it's here. They can make it go away but it's still here. So much for your hypothesis.
- Nullabillity 11y ago
  Representative "democracy" means that you can't say that the people wanted a specific policy, only that they considered some person (and their ELECTION platform, which has just about nothing to do with how they'd actually behave in office) the least awful of the given options. As you said yourself, it was created in secret as a reactionary policy (because those always work out great!), so there was no possible oversight or popular approval.
  - nickpsecurity 11y ago
    People knew about spying. Mostly supported it. Never voted against a politician that did in significant scale. That's direct democracy reinforcing representational democracy. QED.
MichaelBurge 11y ago
I think Bernie Sanders and Rand Paul wants to rein them in. I actually gave Rand Paul some money for this T-shirt: https://store.randpaul.com/index.php/the-nsa-knows-contest-winning-t-shirt.html https://store.randpaul.com/index.php/the-nsa-knows-contest-w... Rand Paul had to drop out for lack of interest.
- nickpsecurity 11y ago
  Apathetic democracy in action. I dropped much of my activism for the same reason. Even when in their perspective, getting Americans to act on protecting their rights is like slogging uphill through molasses. Nice shirt, though. :)

nickpsecurity 11y ago

The forerunners were created in secret for use against enemies during the World War's under Presidents voted in. The people's voted-in Congress representatives that made them official with more authority. Then people kept voting-in even more that kept them over time with no major push to vote out intelligence agencies. Just reform their bad behaviors on occasion. So, yes, they were voted in and maintained through the elected representatives. That's how a representational democracy works. There was also no pushback strong enough to affect an election and dissolve an intelligence agency. They'd be diminished or gone had that happened. So, voters wanted the situation and it's here. They can make it go away but it's still here. So much for your hypothesis.

Nullabillity 11y ago
Representative "democracy" means that you can't say that the people wanted a specific policy, only that they considered some person (and their ELECTION platform, which has just about nothing to do with how they'd actually behave in office) the least awful of the given options. As you said yourself, it was created in secret as a reactionary policy (because those always work out great!), so there was no possible oversight or popular approval.
- nickpsecurity 11y ago
  People knew about spying. Mostly supported it. Never voted against a politician that did in significant scale. That's direct democracy reinforcing representational democracy. QED.

MichaelBurge 11y ago

I think Bernie Sanders and Rand Paul wants to rein them in. I actually gave Rand Paul some money for this T-shirt: https://store.randpaul.com/index.php/the-nsa-knows-contest-winning-t-shirt.html https://store.randpaul.com/index.php/the-nsa-knows-contest-w... Rand Paul had to drop out for lack of interest.

nickpsecurity 11y ago
Apathetic democracy in action. I dropped much of my activism for the same reason. Even when in their perspective, getting Americans to act on protecting their rights is like slogging uphill through molasses. Nice shirt, though. :)