4 ms·

Lead poisoning is especially strange. I'm convinced that I have it, in contrast to the bipolar diagnosis I've been given. I used to do competitive shooting wher

by bpchaps 10y ago

Lead poisoning is especially strange. I'm convinced that I have it, in contrast to the bipolar diagnosis I've been given. I used to do competitive shooting where I'd practice five days out of the week and compete on average of maybe once each weekend. The projectiles we shot were entirely lead, there was never any push for cleaning our hands, and the lead trap was never, ever cleaned (lead dust yay). Problem is, every time I describe the problem and the reasoning behind it, no doctor takes me seriously to the point of laughing sometimes. It's ridiculous that lead's been researched so much, yet no doctor I've talked to understands it enough to even humor the idea. Not trying to self diagnose, but a little bit of "Hmm... yeah, maybe", would be nice. I've also reached out to researchers in the field. The modern ones who've done extensive research have all moved to different fields and aren't willing to help out. Really frustrating. If anybody has any sources for help, I'd love it.

colanderman 10y ago
Have you considered a blood test? [1] You could probably get a referral for generic blood work easily (claim you're concerned about vitamin levels or something), and then ask the testing agency to check for lead levels. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lead_poisoning#Diagnosis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lead_poisoning#Diagnosis
- bpchaps 10y ago
  Blood tests are useless after a certain point, as far as I know. The tests for neurological effects are a bit more complicated and require bone biopsies. Been a while since I've looked into it, so I might be wrong.
  - irremediable 10y ago
    Just from quickly skimming the literature, it looks like you can measure it in vivo with X-ray fluorescence. Getting access to one of those would be hard, but you might be able to persuade a researcher to use you in a trial? I imagine you've already looked into this a fair bit. Are you on medication to help with the (diagnosed) bipolar disorder? Do you find that e.g. lithium eases your symptoms? If so, I'd be inclined to think you're bipolar -- irrespective of whether you also have low-level lead poisoning.
solipsism 10y ago
What kind of outcome would you hope for? Isn't CNS damage from lead irreversible?
- AgentME 10y ago
  It would stop them from wasting time thinking it was something else.
  - bpchaps 10y ago
    Yep, but on top of that, less "throw some shit at it and see if it sticks" sort of treatment.
ridgeguy 10y ago
Possible it was more than the lead bullets. Lead styphnate has been a component of centerfire ammo [1]. That use would put it in vapor form near the firearm where it could be readily inhaled. I agree with another poster - get tested for lead. No matter whether damage done is irreversible or not, it's good to prevent further damage. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centerfire_ammunition https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centerfire_ammunition
- bpchaps 10y ago
  Even though they were center fire, they were .177 lead pellets and I doubt they have that. I'll check it out, though. I actually have had blood tests and nothing came from it. They're not very useful years after the fact.
  - paulmd 10y ago
    The pellets have nothing to do with it - the lead styphnate is used as the primer charge (which then detonates the gunpower). That's why it tends to be aerosolized.
    - bpchaps 10y ago
      Again, they were pellets. In an air rifle. ;)
      - paulmd 10y ago
        Then it's not a centerfire cartridge - there's no cartridge nor primer in an air rifle :) I thought centerfire + small pellets meant you were talking about birdshot though a shotgun, like competitive skeet or trap shooting. But I guess there aren't too many indoor ranges for that (although there is at least one - the MSZU complex in Germany). Or perhaps one of the .177 cartridges like .17 HM2. So we're probably talking about lead contamination on your hands, then. You can clean that off by washing your hands, and as long as you did so after shooting and particularly before you eat, I think you'd probably have been fine. But I'm not a doctor.
vlasev 10y ago
An important question is - do your peers also suffer from similar things?
- bpchaps 10y ago
  I wouldn't doubt it, but it's hard to get back in contact with most of them to confirm. . There was a research paper about an Alaskan rifle team which talks about short term lead poisoning effects, though. I'd imagine they suffered long term effects. I can't find the longer version after a few searches, though.

by bpchaps 10y ago

colanderman 10y ago

Have you considered a blood test? [1] You could probably get a referral for generic blood work easily (claim you're concerned about vitamin levels or something), and then ask the testing agency to check for lead levels. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lead_poisoning#Diagnosis https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lead_poisoning#Diagnosis

bpchaps 10y ago
Blood tests are useless after a certain point, as far as I know. The tests for neurological effects are a bit more complicated and require bone biopsies. Been a while since I've looked into it, so I might be wrong.
- irremediable 10y ago
  Just from quickly skimming the literature, it looks like you can measure it in vivo with X-ray fluorescence. Getting access to one of those would be hard, but you might be able to persuade a researcher to use you in a trial? I imagine you've already looked into this a fair bit. Are you on medication to help with the (diagnosed) bipolar disorder? Do you find that e.g. lithium eases your symptoms? If so, I'd be inclined to think you're bipolar -- irrespective of whether you also have low-level lead poisoning.

solipsism 10y ago

What kind of outcome would you hope for? Isn't CNS damage from lead irreversible?

AgentME 10y ago
It would stop them from wasting time thinking it was something else.
- bpchaps 10y ago
  Yep, but on top of that, less "throw some shit at it and see if it sticks" sort of treatment.

ridgeguy 10y ago

Possible it was more than the lead bullets. Lead styphnate has been a component of centerfire ammo [1]. That use would put it in vapor form near the firearm where it could be readily inhaled. I agree with another poster - get tested for lead. No matter whether damage done is irreversible or not, it's good to prevent further damage. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centerfire_ammunition https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Centerfire_ammunition

bpchaps 10y ago
Even though they were center fire, they were .177 lead pellets and I doubt they have that. I'll check it out, though. I actually have had blood tests and nothing came from it. They're not very useful years after the fact.
- paulmd 10y ago
  The pellets have nothing to do with it - the lead styphnate is used as the primer charge (which then detonates the gunpower). That's why it tends to be aerosolized.
  - bpchaps 10y ago
    Again, they were pellets. In an air rifle. ;)
    - paulmd 10y ago
      Then it's not a centerfire cartridge - there's no cartridge nor primer in an air rifle :) I thought centerfire + small pellets meant you were talking about birdshot though a shotgun, like competitive skeet or trap shooting. But I guess there aren't too many indoor ranges for that (although there is at least one - the MSZU complex in Germany). Or perhaps one of the .177 cartridges like .17 HM2. So we're probably talking about lead contamination on your hands, then. You can clean that off by washing your hands, and as long as you did so after shooting and particularly before you eat, I think you'd probably have been fine. But I'm not a doctor.

vlasev 10y ago

An important question is - do your peers also suffer from similar things?

bpchaps 10y ago
I wouldn't doubt it, but it's hard to get back in contact with most of them to confirm. . There was a research paper about an Alaskan rifle team which talks about short term lead poisoning effects, though. I'd imagine they suffered long term effects. I can't find the longer version after a few searches, though.