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> Logic is no more central to philosophy than... I filled my mandatory philosophy credit hours many years ago, so this might be a very silly question: what ha

by woodman 10y ago

> Logic is no more central to philosophy than... I filled my mandatory philosophy credit hours many years ago, so this might be a very silly question: what happens when a product of philosophy can be demonstrated to logically not follow? It was my impression that such a product would be discarded, making logic extremely important in philosophy - unlike, unfortunately, many other human endeavors.

igravious 10y ago
Good point. I see it this way. Logic is a method. It is one of the ways _how_ philosophy does what it does. (You could argue it is the only way, and many would not disagree with you.) However, consider what other disciplines do not require logically coherent inferences. Most, no? Art is one of the few which does not. Therefore logic is not central to philosophy because it is central to practically all disciplines! What is central to philosophy is, as I said, _abstraction_. The willingness to go meta-, to stand back from what you're looking at and questions the conditions of its possibilities. Do you see where I'm coming from? To make a stronger point, and to not at the same time denigrate your position, philosophers go astray when they focus on logic. :)
- woodman 10y ago
  I see, I think we are pretty close to the point of debating how true a truth is. I think the real difference between the disciplines, in the application of logic, is highlighted by your use of "coherent". While an engineer will work mostly to build upon a set of precepts, philosophy is charged with the responsibility of deconstruction. Of the two, who is spending time wondering about the abstract concept of the number one? I think that focus on local coherence is what led philosophers in the dark ages to debate whether Adam had a navel, as the premise was left unchecked. So I'd say that philosophers go astray when they do not focus on logic.
Retric 10y ago
Logic has little value in philosophy because the terms have no specific inherent meaning. The solution seems to be to fix specific meaning to terms, but your stuck using meaningless terms to do so. Queue a recursive waste of time. Though people are used to ambiguity and love extracting meaning from arbitrary stories, so it's not all that obvious of an issue. At its core philosophy is not about extracting meaning through analysis it's about conveying what someone has already desided to be true.
- woodman 10y ago
  > ...it's about conveying what someone has already desided to be true. I think the field strives for a little more than that, at the very least discussion is preferred to rote learning. Logic provides a common language for that discussion.
- jwatte 10y ago
  Why do you think logic is taught as part of the philosophy department in US universities, not the math or comp sci department? Personally, I think the means of abstraction and logical reasoning we take for granted today are the direct result of thousands of years of philosophy!
  - 78666cdc 10y ago
    Logic is taught exactly in mathematics and computer science programs as a mandatory topic. Philosophy programs place far less emphasis, often providing it only as an elective.
  - Retric 10y ago
    A) Depends on the school. But, it is commonly set up this way so people can satisfy general ED requirements without 'wasting' a class. If you read through this list there are logic class from several departments. (Mathematics, Computer Science, and Philosophy) http://logic.harvard.edu/courses.php http://logic.harvard.edu/courses.php B) Randomly trying things for thousands of years is likely to produce some interesting results. That does not mean doing so is a good idea.

by woodman 10y ago

igravious 10y ago

Good point. I see it this way. Logic is a method. It is one of the ways _how_ philosophy does what it does. (You could argue it is the only way, and many would not disagree with you.) However, consider what other disciplines do not require logically coherent inferences. Most, no? Art is one of the few which does not. Therefore logic is not central to philosophy because it is central to practically all disciplines! What is central to philosophy is, as I said, _abstraction_. The willingness to go meta-, to stand back from what you're looking at and questions the conditions of its possibilities. Do you see where I'm coming from? To make a stronger point, and to not at the same time denigrate your position, philosophers go astray when they focus on logic. :)

woodman 10y ago
I see, I think we are pretty close to the point of debating how true a truth is. I think the real difference between the disciplines, in the application of logic, is highlighted by your use of "coherent". While an engineer will work mostly to build upon a set of precepts, philosophy is charged with the responsibility of deconstruction. Of the two, who is spending time wondering about the abstract concept of the number one? I think that focus on local coherence is what led philosophers in the dark ages to debate whether Adam had a navel, as the premise was left unchecked. So I'd say that philosophers go astray when they do not focus on logic.

Retric 10y ago

Logic has little value in philosophy because the terms have no specific inherent meaning. The solution seems to be to fix specific meaning to terms, but your stuck using meaningless terms to do so. Queue a recursive waste of time. Though people are used to ambiguity and love extracting meaning from arbitrary stories, so it's not all that obvious of an issue. At its core philosophy is not about extracting meaning through analysis it's about conveying what someone has already desided to be true.

woodman 10y ago
> ...it's about conveying what someone has already desided to be true. I think the field strives for a little more than that, at the very least discussion is preferred to rote learning. Logic provides a common language for that discussion.
jwatte 10y ago
Why do you think logic is taught as part of the philosophy department in US universities, not the math or comp sci department? Personally, I think the means of abstraction and logical reasoning we take for granted today are the direct result of thousands of years of philosophy!
- 78666cdc 10y ago
  Logic is taught exactly in mathematics and computer science programs as a mandatory topic. Philosophy programs place far less emphasis, often providing it only as an elective.
- Retric 10y ago
  A) Depends on the school. But, it is commonly set up this way so people can satisfy general ED requirements without 'wasting' a class. If you read through this list there are logic class from several departments. (Mathematics, Computer Science, and Philosophy) http://logic.harvard.edu/courses.php http://logic.harvard.edu/courses.php B) Randomly trying things for thousands of years is likely to produce some interesting results. That does not mean doing so is a good idea.