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Software engineering is not a flat domain. I work in a web-based e-commerce outfit with 30+ other SEs who are all really into their work, smart, and committed

Software engineering is not a flat domain. I work in a web-based e-commerce outfit with 30+ other SEs who are all really into their work, smart, and committed to doing the Right Thing. This is a good gig. If I was working on a COBOL app on a mainframe where all the documentation was in German - and I was offered the chance to interview for that gig just a year ago - I doubt I would have as much fun. As a Ruby/Go/Rust/Python type of developer, I suspect - but can't be certain - my days are more fun than a Java developers. They all seem miserable, anyway. I don't wear a tie. I don't wear a suit. Nobody cares if I'm a few minutes late in as long as I make stand-up. Nobody cares if I work from home if I feel like it as long as I make core meetings in person. Would I get that writing J2EE code for a large corporate? Probably not. Would the people who enjoy those environments enjoy working in a startup? Or a games dev house? Or where I work? Probably not. I think the best thing about a Software Engineer is we kind find places that fit us culturally more easily than many other industries: medicine, law, most heavy industry, etc. all have a very strong culture that absorbs almost all players in that field.

pc86 11y ago
> Nobody cares if I'm a few minutes late in as long as I make stand-up. I see this sentiment a lot. What is HN's aversion to showing up to work on time?
- jetengine 11y ago
  I'm pretty sure that a significant portion of programmers are night owls and don't like showing up before 10 AM.
  - pc86 11y ago
    I'm pretty sure that people are different and there are plenty of programmers that are the exact opposite.
    - mden 11y ago
      Well, it's great that they are not forced to show up late then.
- hnrodey 11y ago
  "on time" is a relative term. Assuming you show up, work your time, make your meetings and commitments and be a reasonably accountable person - no one will care what time you start the day whether it is 5am or 10am.
  - pc86 11y ago
    This is just not true. There are offices that have legitimate reasons for requiring employees to be there at certain times. I've worked in secured locations that were all but inaccessible at 6:01 pm and you needed a good reason to be there after 5. In an environment like that, you can't stroll in at 10:30 because you prefer to sleep in. A lot of folks on HN seem to have this idea that as long as you show up it shouldn't matter what time you get there, how long your lunch is, when you leave, or how many hours you are working vs. sitting on Facebook, and there should be this pure meritocratic judgment based solely on the quality of your work. Maybe that's ideal, but it's 100% unrealistic. In an office environment, showing up on time, not leaving early, and not taking a two hour lunch should pretty much be the minimum.
    - hnrodey 11y ago
      Certainly there are exceptions to what I said - there's always an exception. But I think the picture painted in your comment is the exception, not the rule.
    - Joof 11y ago
      There are certainly exceptions as you mention, but if there isn't a good reason then why bother with it? This seems largely within the cultural spirit of programming; if there is tedium/bureaucracy, automate it away or solve it with technology. For me, it's a necessity. I have fairly severe circadian rhythm problems and getting to work earlier is asking me to be unproductive, depressed and tired.

pc86 11y ago

> Nobody cares if I'm a few minutes late in as long as I make stand-up. I see this sentiment a lot. What is HN's aversion to showing up to work on time?

jetengine 11y ago
I'm pretty sure that a significant portion of programmers are night owls and don't like showing up before 10 AM.
- pc86 11y ago
  I'm pretty sure that people are different and there are plenty of programmers that are the exact opposite.
  - mden 11y ago
    Well, it's great that they are not forced to show up late then.
hnrodey 11y ago
"on time" is a relative term. Assuming you show up, work your time, make your meetings and commitments and be a reasonably accountable person - no one will care what time you start the day whether it is 5am or 10am.
- pc86 11y ago
  This is just not true. There are offices that have legitimate reasons for requiring employees to be there at certain times. I've worked in secured locations that were all but inaccessible at 6:01 pm and you needed a good reason to be there after 5. In an environment like that, you can't stroll in at 10:30 because you prefer to sleep in. A lot of folks on HN seem to have this idea that as long as you show up it shouldn't matter what time you get there, how long your lunch is, when you leave, or how many hours you are working vs. sitting on Facebook, and there should be this pure meritocratic judgment based solely on the quality of your work. Maybe that's ideal, but it's 100% unrealistic. In an office environment, showing up on time, not leaving early, and not taking a two hour lunch should pretty much be the minimum.
  - hnrodey 11y ago
    Certainly there are exceptions to what I said - there's always an exception. But I think the picture painted in your comment is the exception, not the rule.
  - Joof 11y ago
    There are certainly exceptions as you mention, but if there isn't a good reason then why bother with it? This seems largely within the cultural spirit of programming; if there is tedium/bureaucracy, automate it away or solve it with technology. For me, it's a necessity. I have fairly severe circadian rhythm problems and getting to work earlier is asking me to be unproductive, depressed and tired.