5 ms·

Hm... Did Ada Lovelace actually change the course of technology? Or was she just a genious who was (unfortunately) way ahead of her time and thus unable to appl

by tomp 11y ago

Hm... Did Ada Lovelace actually change the course of technology? Or was she just a genious who was (unfortunately) way ahead of her time and thus unable to apply her talents in practice (somewhat like Leonardo da Vinci)?

vanderZwan 11y ago
From what I understand Babbage would not have achieved what he had without their collaboration; and I do not mean that in a sexist "supportive wife-surrogate to the world's most famous hater of organ grinders" kind of way, but as a full partner in developing cutting edge technology.
- mafribe 11y ago
  From what I understood, Babbage invented his computers himself. Lovelace was helpful to him because of her high-society connection. He was hoping to popularise his work and get more funding.
  - vanderZwan 11y ago
    Even if it was the case that she was a "mere" patron who was into the science behind the machine itself and helped with popularising it, few people would downplay the importance of Steve Jobs for the course of computer history. So by that logic, either way we look at it she changed the course of technology.
    - a_imho 11y ago
      Agree on the Lovelace part, but outside the Apple bubble many don't really place Steve Jobs that high in the pantheon of computing and I predict his cult status won't last as many of his contemporaries.
      - deepnet 11y ago
        Jobs got all his computing innovations from Xerox Parc & Woz. That he transformed society by successfully commercialising those ideas is undisputable. Alan Kay's Dynabook was an innovation, Jobs realised this innovation in the iPhone, transforming society as Kay predicted truly portable computers would. Again with windowing & GUIs, without Jobs Xerox Parc's ideas may have been lost to history. So he did radically change the course of technology which is the OPs title. Innovations languish without succesful implementation.
  - tomlock 11y ago
    Have a read of the "Notes by the Translator": http://www.fourmilab.ch/babbage/sketch.html http://www.fourmilab.ch/babbage/sketch.html Do you now think Lovelace was only useful to Babbage in the manner you describe?
    - mafribe 11y ago
      Which of the original content is from Babbage, which from Lovelace?
      - tomlock 11y ago
        Maybe Julius Caesar was just two women taped together in a Roman Emperor suit?
- tomp 11y ago
  How exactly did Babbage's invention influence the course of history? AFAIK, it wasn't actually realized until like 100 years later. Although a mere idea (of a "computer") could be influential by itself...
  - deepnet 11y ago
    Babbage's Difference Engine was later built by others shortly after, producing log tables. The original idea was Müller's who preceeded Babbage. Babbage produced a workable implementation. The mechanical method of finite differences was built in many successor machines, mechanical calculators are myriad til the 1980's. The methods were also used by the original computers, rooms of people computing parts of a sum - these very methods were used at Bletchly Park during the war. Turing had read Babbages writings. The methods of mechanical calculation informed his Bombe machine. The Analytical engine though never built directly inspired most early computer pioneers just to believe it was possible. Lovelace's vision of automatic computation of numbers representing algebras, thoughts & music - directly inspired Alan Turing and A.I. Punch cards were used in most early computers but this idea originates much earlier with Jacquard and his programmable weaving looms. Babbage also proposed a packet switching semaphore network on church steeples, never built but his exposition of the efficiencies of packet switching was part of its history.
    - mafribe 11y ago
      Babbage also proposed a packet switching semaphore network Interesting. Could you point me towards a description of Babbage's ideas?
      - deepnet 11y ago
        Perhaps from his other writings or I misremembered a bit but present in parts in "Economy of Machinery and Manufactures", Babbage 1832, (1846 edition) ..."In order to convey the cylinder which contains the letters, it would only be necessary to attach it by a string, or by a catch, to either of the branches of the endless wire. Thus it would be con- veyed speedily to the next station, where it would be removed by the attendant to the commencement of the next wire, and so forwarded."..."Perhaps if the steeples of churches, properly selected, were made use of, connecting them by a few intermediate stations with some great central building, as, for instance, with the top of St. Paul's"..."it might be possible to diminish the expense of the two-penny post, and make deliveries every half hour over the greater part of the metropolis." On National Speaking tubes: ..."Admitting it to be possible between London and Liverpool, about seventeen minutes would elapse before the words spoken at one end would reach the other extremity of the pipe." On semaphore & telegraph: "At Liverpool a system of signals is established for the purposes of commerce, so that each merchant can communicate with his own vessel long before she arrives in the port." https://archive.org/details/oneconomyofmachi00babbrich https://archive.org/details/oneconomyofmachi00babbrich
- SixSigma 11y ago
  but really, what was actually achieved ?
  - vanderZwan 11y ago
    Yeah well the first cell with a nucleus didn't amount to much either... come one, what kind of question is that?
    - SixSigma 11y ago
      I mean, we appreciate now what he did but no-one stood on his giant shoulders

by tomp 11y ago

vanderZwan 11y ago

From what I understand Babbage would not have achieved what he had without their collaboration; and I do not mean that in a sexist "supportive wife-surrogate to the world's most famous hater of organ grinders" kind of way, but as a full partner in developing cutting edge technology.

mafribe 11y ago
From what I understood, Babbage invented his computers himself. Lovelace was helpful to him because of her high-society connection. He was hoping to popularise his work and get more funding.
- vanderZwan 11y ago
  Even if it was the case that she was a "mere" patron who was into the science behind the machine itself and helped with popularising it, few people would downplay the importance of Steve Jobs for the course of computer history. So by that logic, either way we look at it she changed the course of technology.
  - a_imho 11y ago
    Agree on the Lovelace part, but outside the Apple bubble many don't really place Steve Jobs that high in the pantheon of computing and I predict his cult status won't last as many of his contemporaries.
    - deepnet 11y ago
      Jobs got all his computing innovations from Xerox Parc & Woz. That he transformed society by successfully commercialising those ideas is undisputable. Alan Kay's Dynabook was an innovation, Jobs realised this innovation in the iPhone, transforming society as Kay predicted truly portable computers would. Again with windowing & GUIs, without Jobs Xerox Parc's ideas may have been lost to history. So he did radically change the course of technology which is the OPs title. Innovations languish without succesful implementation.
- tomlock 11y ago
  Have a read of the "Notes by the Translator": http://www.fourmilab.ch/babbage/sketch.html http://www.fourmilab.ch/babbage/sketch.html Do you now think Lovelace was only useful to Babbage in the manner you describe?
  - mafribe 11y ago
    Which of the original content is from Babbage, which from Lovelace?
    - tomlock 11y ago
      Maybe Julius Caesar was just two women taped together in a Roman Emperor suit?
tomp 11y ago
How exactly did Babbage's invention influence the course of history? AFAIK, it wasn't actually realized until like 100 years later. Although a mere idea (of a "computer") could be influential by itself...
- deepnet 11y ago
  Babbage's Difference Engine was later built by others shortly after, producing log tables. The original idea was Müller's who preceeded Babbage. Babbage produced a workable implementation. The mechanical method of finite differences was built in many successor machines, mechanical calculators are myriad til the 1980's. The methods were also used by the original computers, rooms of people computing parts of a sum - these very methods were used at Bletchly Park during the war. Turing had read Babbages writings. The methods of mechanical calculation informed his Bombe machine. The Analytical engine though never built directly inspired most early computer pioneers just to believe it was possible. Lovelace's vision of automatic computation of numbers representing algebras, thoughts & music - directly inspired Alan Turing and A.I. Punch cards were used in most early computers but this idea originates much earlier with Jacquard and his programmable weaving looms. Babbage also proposed a packet switching semaphore network on church steeples, never built but his exposition of the efficiencies of packet switching was part of its history.
  - mafribe 11y ago
    Babbage also proposed a packet switching semaphore network Interesting. Could you point me towards a description of Babbage's ideas?
    - deepnet 11y ago
      Perhaps from his other writings or I misremembered a bit but present in parts in "Economy of Machinery and Manufactures", Babbage 1832, (1846 edition) ..."In order to convey the cylinder which contains the letters, it would only be necessary to attach it by a string, or by a catch, to either of the branches of the endless wire. Thus it would be con- veyed speedily to the next station, where it would be removed by the attendant to the commencement of the next wire, and so forwarded."..."Perhaps if the steeples of churches, properly selected, were made use of, connecting them by a few intermediate stations with some great central building, as, for instance, with the top of St. Paul's"..."it might be possible to diminish the expense of the two-penny post, and make deliveries every half hour over the greater part of the metropolis." On National Speaking tubes: ..."Admitting it to be possible between London and Liverpool, about seventeen minutes would elapse before the words spoken at one end would reach the other extremity of the pipe." On semaphore & telegraph: "At Liverpool a system of signals is established for the purposes of commerce, so that each merchant can communicate with his own vessel long before she arrives in the port." https://archive.org/details/oneconomyofmachi00babbrich https://archive.org/details/oneconomyofmachi00babbrich
SixSigma 11y ago
but really, what was actually achieved ?
- vanderZwan 11y ago
  Yeah well the first cell with a nucleus didn't amount to much either... come one, what kind of question is that?
  - SixSigma 11y ago
    I mean, we appreciate now what he did but no-one stood on his giant shoulders