3 ms·

As I noted in my own mention http://highlandsun.com/hyc/#Make http://highlandsun.com/hyc/#Make I originally wrote that patch back in 1991. There was no such thi

As I noted in my own mention http://highlandsun.com/hyc/#Make http://highlandsun.com/hyc/#Make I originally wrote that patch back in 1991. There was no such thing as threads back then. Even in 1999 the POSIX threads spec was only up to Draft 6 or so, not yet finalized. Nobody sane would write production code for such a moving target (oh, except maybe Microsoft, using Draft4 to create the Windows NT threads API).

JdeBP 10y ago
That parenthetical history is wrong, at least according to Dave Cutler. He traced Windows NT's threading back to his work on VAXELN in 1983, years before POSIX was even thought of. He also was quite obviously deriving the NT API in part from OS/2, again not POSIX, given the whole "mutant"/"mutex" affair.
- hyc_symas 10y ago
  Windows NT RPC is DCE RPC - that is an indisputable fact. DCE used POSIX Draft 4, and Windows copied DCE pretty completely there. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DCEThreads https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DCEThreads
  - JdeBP 10y ago
    Well now we know where all of your errors are coming from. Regrettably, you've learned a lot of bunkum, that you now have to un-learn. The source of that bunkum, or at least the source that you've pointed to, is a canonical example of how rubbish turns into gospel via Wikipedia. It started out, in August 2005, as an intentionally opinionated rant written by someone who didn't supply xyr name, who clearly didn't know the subject, and who pointed to entities that didn't exist at the time in question as xyr authorities. * https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=DCEThreads&oldid=21947270 https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=DCEThreads&oldid=... Other people came along and tried to take the opinions out and leave the facts. But the underlying problem was that the facts weren't factual at all, and were as warped as the rest of the rant was; and no-one with any actual knowledge of the topic, or research ability, has touched the article significantly in eleven years. * https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=DCEThreads&type=revision&diff=641382127&oldid=23011764 https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=DCEThreads&type=r... And in the meantime, people come along, believe Wikipedia uncritically, and regurgitate a load of old tripe. Here are some of the things that you have to learn in place of the un-learned junk: * There were such things as threads in 1991. There were such things as threads in 1988 when Dave Cutler started on "NT OS/2" at Microsoft. There were such things as threads in 1987 when OS/2 version 1.0 was announced. And indeed in 1983 in VAXELN according to Dave Cutler. * Threads are not RPC, DCE RPC or otherwise. * The design of Windows NT threads pre-dated the existence of 1003.4a draft 4 (dated 1990-08-10). By years. For far better things than Wikipedia to read on this subject, see: * Inside Windows NT. Particularly page 92 of the 1st edition. * Cutler's own Windows NT Mutant Specification, written in 1989. * Mark Russinovich's writings on the subject of Windows NT and its VMS heritage. * Any good book on OS/2 version 1.0 programming that details the threads API. * Michael Yam's 1996 Dr Dobbs article on porting his wrapper class library from DCE to Win32 threads. * Any number of books on the subject of DCE, explaining the two quite different things that are DCE RPC and DCE threads.

JdeBP 10y ago

That parenthetical history is wrong, at least according to Dave Cutler. He traced Windows NT's threading back to his work on VAXELN in 1983, years before POSIX was even thought of. He also was quite obviously deriving the NT API in part from OS/2, again not POSIX, given the whole "mutant"/"mutex" affair.

hyc_symas 10y ago
Windows NT RPC is DCE RPC - that is an indisputable fact. DCE used POSIX Draft 4, and Windows copied DCE pretty completely there. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DCEThreads https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DCEThreads
- JdeBP 10y ago
  Well now we know where all of your errors are coming from. Regrettably, you've learned a lot of bunkum, that you now have to un-learn. The source of that bunkum, or at least the source that you've pointed to, is a canonical example of how rubbish turns into gospel via Wikipedia. It started out, in August 2005, as an intentionally opinionated rant written by someone who didn't supply xyr name, who clearly didn't know the subject, and who pointed to entities that didn't exist at the time in question as xyr authorities. * https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=DCEThreads&oldid=21947270 https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=DCEThreads&oldid=... Other people came along and tried to take the opinions out and leave the facts. But the underlying problem was that the facts weren't factual at all, and were as warped as the rest of the rant was; and no-one with any actual knowledge of the topic, or research ability, has touched the article significantly in eleven years. * https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=DCEThreads&type=revision&diff=641382127&oldid=23011764 https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=DCEThreads&type=r... And in the meantime, people come along, believe Wikipedia uncritically, and regurgitate a load of old tripe. Here are some of the things that you have to learn in place of the un-learned junk: * There were such things as threads in 1991. There were such things as threads in 1988 when Dave Cutler started on "NT OS/2" at Microsoft. There were such things as threads in 1987 when OS/2 version 1.0 was announced. And indeed in 1983 in VAXELN according to Dave Cutler. * Threads are not RPC, DCE RPC or otherwise. * The design of Windows NT threads pre-dated the existence of 1003.4a draft 4 (dated 1990-08-10). By years. For far better things than Wikipedia to read on this subject, see: * Inside Windows NT. Particularly page 92 of the 1st edition. * Cutler's own Windows NT Mutant Specification, written in 1989. * Mark Russinovich's writings on the subject of Windows NT and its VMS heritage. * Any good book on OS/2 version 1.0 programming that details the threads API. * Michael Yam's 1996 Dr Dobbs article on porting his wrapper class library from DCE to Win32 threads. * Any number of books on the subject of DCE, explaining the two quite different things that are DCE RPC and DCE threads.