5 ms·

Yes but casual cyclists will not pay €2499 for the pleasure of doing so

maxerickson 11y ago
I didn't mean that they would, just that light weight and performance get a lot of consideration in cycling so it can be expected that a product category will address them even if it isn't aimed at pros.
chinathrow 11y ago
Of course they do - imagine ladies training with men only. Imagine folks at the age of 70 still wanting to ride with their sons etc.
- celticninja 11y ago
  In those situations you don't need it to be hidden therefore you could get a bigger and better battery for the same price.
alistairSH 11y ago
It depends how you define "casual". I tend to think of casual cyclists as avid cyclists who don't race. Anybody who isn't avid is just a guy/gal on a bike. By that definition, casual cyclists spend ridiculous amounts of money on cycling kit. $2000 for a set of carbon fiber wheels. $1000 for a power meter. Trek has a custom line of bikes (Project One) that retail in the $7000-$15000 range (US).
- zyxley 11y ago
  By my thoughts, somebody who's spent more than $1000 or so on bike and gear, maximum, isn't a "casual" cyclist. If they're buying individual parts that cost more than an entire road bike that would be recommended by a store clerk to some guy walking in off the street, they're well beyond "casual".
  - exDM69 11y ago
    That isn't too much to spend on a bike. My bike is more than that and isn't special in any way, just a good regular bike. And I just use it to ride to work, this isn't anything I'm enthusiastic about. Add the bags/panniers, lights, pump, clothing and other accessories on top. I get about 100 miles a week, 8-9 months a year so it justifies the investment.
    - Symbiote 11y ago
      I'd say anyone who has special clothing for cycling is an enthusiast, particularly if it's more than $50 worth.
      - exDM69 11y ago
        I don't have that either. Just some gear to withstand light rain and cold. Nothing that's especially made for cycling, I use this with other outdoors activities too. My way to work is too long to comfortably ride in work clothes. Imagine riding 8 miles in your jeans and sweater and then sitting in front of the computer all day in the same clothes after that. You're trying to label people "cycling enthusiasts" in your heads (and I know exactly the stereotype you're thinking of). They do exist, but for most people riding a bike, it's just their daily commute. It might need a decent bike and a few items of clothing. You don't call every car owner a "car enthusiast" even though taking the train/bus is a viable option in many places of the world and owning a car is much more expensive than a bike.
  - poooogles 11y ago
    By this logic, you're a motorsport enthusiast if you've spent more than $1000 on a car? $1000 get's you a decent entry level bike to commute on, that's pretty casual if you ask me.
    - jeeva 11y ago
      Given that I suspect you can't get a brand-new assembled car for $1000, I'd say you could extend the "motorsport enthusiast" level to $20000 or more easily. [Please note that I've never bought a new car, nor a car in America]
- Grishnakh 11y ago
  Those aren't "casual" bikes. Maybe you could call them "prosumer", but really those are ridiculous prices for bikes, that's like calling a $300k Ferrari a car for "casual" car fans. You can walk into any decent bike shop in the US now and buy a very nice carbon-frame bike for $2-3k, and a really nice aluminum-frame bike for under $1k. And these are road bikes BTW, where there simply is no low-end market any more: if you want a low-end bike, you go to Walmart and buy a $100-150 mountain bike. If you're spending more money on a bike than a new economy car costs, that is not even remotely "casual", and not even "avid" unless you're someone who has more money than you know what to do with.
- celticninja 11y ago
  I guess I consider myself casual, I cycle to commute and for fun but I don't spend $2k on wheels.
- seanp2k2 11y ago
  In Silicon Valley, I see people all the time riding >$5k bikes as commuters. It's also not uncommon to see people here riding carbon aero wheels (thousands of dollars for a set) on casual rides or getting groceries. It's the "taking the Ferrari to pick up milk". Free country and all, I just find it a massive waste; they'd be better off with some sew-ups and light rims instead of deep-section carbon jobs, but I guess they do it for the bling more than the performance.
  - poooogles 11y ago
    >Free country and all, I just find it a massive waste; they'd be better off with some sew-ups and light rims instead of deep-section carbon jobs, but I guess they do it for the bling more than the performance. Depends upon the roads you ride. For anything less than 4/5% aero is king. Sure light weight feels nicer to ride, but if you're after performance then you're in the wrong place. Saying that, perception plays a huge part in performance, so heh.
Coding_Cat 11y ago
2499 is a pretty reasonable price for an electric bike though.
- celticninja 11y ago
  I imagine that you could get more efficient ie more power at lower cost, for your money if you were looking for something that did not need to be hidden away.
- seanp2k2 11y ago
  There's also the power factor. These hidden motors are on the order of a few hundred watts. While enough to make a huge difference, if you want a non-hidden version, you can get a few hundred watts for a few hundred bucks: https://www.electricbike.com/12-kit-power-levels-360w-to-8000w/ https://www.electricbike.com/12-kit-power-levels-360w-to-800... to well into the thousands of watts range for $2500. The price is because it's stealthy.

I didn't mean that they would, just that light weight and performance get a lot of consideration in cycling so it can be expected that a product category will address them even if it isn't aimed at pros.

chinathrow 11y ago

Of course they do - imagine ladies training with men only. Imagine folks at the age of 70 still wanting to ride with their sons etc.

celticninja 11y ago
In those situations you don't need it to be hidden therefore you could get a bigger and better battery for the same price.

alistairSH 11y ago

It depends how you define "casual". I tend to think of casual cyclists as avid cyclists who don't race. Anybody who isn't avid is just a guy/gal on a bike. By that definition, casual cyclists spend ridiculous amounts of money on cycling kit. $2000 for a set of carbon fiber wheels. $1000 for a power meter. Trek has a custom line of bikes (Project One) that retail in the $7000-$15000 range (US).

zyxley 11y ago
By my thoughts, somebody who's spent more than $1000 or so on bike and gear, maximum, isn't a "casual" cyclist. If they're buying individual parts that cost more than an entire road bike that would be recommended by a store clerk to some guy walking in off the street, they're well beyond "casual".
- exDM69 11y ago
  That isn't too much to spend on a bike. My bike is more than that and isn't special in any way, just a good regular bike. And I just use it to ride to work, this isn't anything I'm enthusiastic about. Add the bags/panniers, lights, pump, clothing and other accessories on top. I get about 100 miles a week, 8-9 months a year so it justifies the investment.
  - Symbiote 11y ago
    I'd say anyone who has special clothing for cycling is an enthusiast, particularly if it's more than $50 worth.
    - exDM69 11y ago
      I don't have that either. Just some gear to withstand light rain and cold. Nothing that's especially made for cycling, I use this with other outdoors activities too. My way to work is too long to comfortably ride in work clothes. Imagine riding 8 miles in your jeans and sweater and then sitting in front of the computer all day in the same clothes after that. You're trying to label people "cycling enthusiasts" in your heads (and I know exactly the stereotype you're thinking of). They do exist, but for most people riding a bike, it's just their daily commute. It might need a decent bike and a few items of clothing. You don't call every car owner a "car enthusiast" even though taking the train/bus is a viable option in many places of the world and owning a car is much more expensive than a bike.
- poooogles 11y ago
  By this logic, you're a motorsport enthusiast if you've spent more than $1000 on a car? $1000 get's you a decent entry level bike to commute on, that's pretty casual if you ask me.
  - jeeva 11y ago
    Given that I suspect you can't get a brand-new assembled car for $1000, I'd say you could extend the "motorsport enthusiast" level to $20000 or more easily. [Please note that I've never bought a new car, nor a car in America]
Grishnakh 11y ago
Those aren't "casual" bikes. Maybe you could call them "prosumer", but really those are ridiculous prices for bikes, that's like calling a $300k Ferrari a car for "casual" car fans. You can walk into any decent bike shop in the US now and buy a very nice carbon-frame bike for $2-3k, and a really nice aluminum-frame bike for under $1k. And these are road bikes BTW, where there simply is no low-end market any more: if you want a low-end bike, you go to Walmart and buy a $100-150 mountain bike. If you're spending more money on a bike than a new economy car costs, that is not even remotely "casual", and not even "avid" unless you're someone who has more money than you know what to do with.
celticninja 11y ago
I guess I consider myself casual, I cycle to commute and for fun but I don't spend $2k on wheels.
seanp2k2 11y ago
In Silicon Valley, I see people all the time riding >$5k bikes as commuters. It's also not uncommon to see people here riding carbon aero wheels (thousands of dollars for a set) on casual rides or getting groceries. It's the "taking the Ferrari to pick up milk". Free country and all, I just find it a massive waste; they'd be better off with some sew-ups and light rims instead of deep-section carbon jobs, but I guess they do it for the bling more than the performance.
- poooogles 11y ago
  >Free country and all, I just find it a massive waste; they'd be better off with some sew-ups and light rims instead of deep-section carbon jobs, but I guess they do it for the bling more than the performance. Depends upon the roads you ride. For anything less than 4/5% aero is king. Sure light weight feels nicer to ride, but if you're after performance then you're in the wrong place. Saying that, perception plays a huge part in performance, so heh.

Coding_Cat 11y ago

2499 is a pretty reasonable price for an electric bike though.

celticninja 11y ago
I imagine that you could get more efficient ie more power at lower cost, for your money if you were looking for something that did not need to be hidden away.
seanp2k2 11y ago
There's also the power factor. These hidden motors are on the order of a few hundred watts. While enough to make a huge difference, if you want a non-hidden version, you can get a few hundred watts for a few hundred bucks: https://www.electricbike.com/12-kit-power-levels-360w-to-8000w/ https://www.electricbike.com/12-kit-power-levels-360w-to-800... to well into the thousands of watts range for $2500. The price is because it's stealthy.